Nov-17-2018 8:05 AM
Hey Chris, daliens already mentioned that article here (on the 15th) before Avp Galaxy (article dating from the 16th), maybe give credit to him instead.
Nov-17-2018 8:25 AM
Ah! Thanks very much, I was sent the Galaxy article over social but didn't have a chance to see your post on the forums here. Nice job! I would say you should submit info like that as a news article instead of a forum topic so it automatically hits the homepage.
I will adjust the credit accordingly. :)
Nov-17-2018 9:39 AM
I guess its one of those..
Do we believe the words from out of RS mouth or some so called Source?
As i mentioned on the other Topic, it would seem that WORK had commenced on the PLOT for the next movie, what would happen is RS and Logan (potentially others) would sit down and Brainstorm were to take the next movie, what it SHOULD and WOULD-NOT contain.... then once they arrive at this point which i think they had.... its then left to Logan to Write up a Draft and Submit it.
Bare in mind IF we get to this point then its only the First Stage as then its unlikely any First Submission would get the GO-AHEAD
so i think for Certain RS comments have to at least indicate they know what they want to do and want to show and it then entered the Period of Logan working on the Draft but the Concept/Idea of what the Draft would contain is FINISHED but they are working on putting those ideas into a Draft.
It could be that Logan had Finished his First Draft.
But certainly could seem that a Final Draft has not been reached, and regardless of that Article i think any ALIEN movie is in a state of Limbo... Certainly Ideas had been going around and work being done, and Certainly FOX would have been interested... But when the company went into Take-Over Talks i feel work may have halted or slowed down.
I think ONCE we have RS next Sci-Fi Project Released, (Raised by Wolves) then maybe he would make some comments towards the Alien Franchise.
If there is ANY News then i think it would be ideal to emerge or announce by or on ALIEN DAY 2019 i feel come after April 26th 2019 if we get No News or any News that confirms the Franchise is on Hold... then we can start to worry about not seeing a conclusion anytime soon.
Regarding going to the Planet.... i think this is the intention... they will be going to LV-426 eventually. But i dont think it means that David will be taking the Covenant Ship to LV-426. I cant find any reason WHY
I find more reason to go to LV-223 but with the comments Ridley Scott made, it does-not paint the Picture that this is Davids First Port of Call.
Nov-17-2018 9:44 AM
Another thing to remember, and especially with a Hold-up (due to Take Over) is the Set-up and comments by RS and Direction of Alien Covenant are things that are being Heavily Criticized and lack Anticipation
While Fans dont have the Final Say, the Production company would be looking more for a Movie that Makes $$$$ rather than a Plot/Story that say Ridley Scott favors.
And so what ever point they are at as far as the Plot for the Next Movie, we cant Guarantee what % of this would remain after No-Doubt those at Disney (if they wish to pursue a sequel) have taken time to Gauge what kind of Plot will attract the Box Office Seats.
Nov-17-2018 11:33 AM
"Or are BMD's sources merely addressing the rumors around the Alien: Awakening title?"
I think - this. Maybe Alien: Awakening called differently?
Nov-17-2018 1:12 PM
I think that's most likely the reason for this clarification. Awakening was likely the working title for Alien 5 not Covenant 2, as originally thought. The talk of both films around the same time was what caused the confusion there.
Nov-17-2018 4:37 PM
I dont think RS was hyping it up, if there was any hyping up being done it was with Alien 5. When Alien Covenant was given the Green Light we can be sure it was not a Green Light for a single movie, it would have been for a series that would have lead to the Back Door of ALIEN so the movie was made lending towards having at least a sequel.
At the time prior to Alien Covenant's release you can be sure they had some of the Broad-strokes to where they would be taking the Prequels. I think the Announcement of when the Rights to 20th Century Fox was being Sold Off, this would put a Hold or at least a Slow down to any such projects. The Criticism and Disappointing Box Office may also have but the breaks on the sequel a little.... but the Pending Take Over Talks could well have put a Stop to it for the time being.
It was revealed that Awakening was the Title to Alien 5, well RS had said this was the case, so that means they decided to borrow the name of Blomkamps Alien 5 and if thats correct then thats a bit of a underhanded move.... oh yeah thank you Blomkamp but we wont be making Alien 5 we will be making a Prometheus 2 but we like the name Alien Awakening so we use this for Prometheus 3.
I think thing to consider is Ridley Scott does get muddled up a bit at times and he could have got thinks mixed up... he did say in ONE Interview after Alien Covenant that the series would go Prometheus, Awakening and then Covenant....
Which led to people to think... hang on so the next movie is going to be a sequel to Prometheus but a Prequel to Alien Covenant?
Looking at the Events of Alien Covenant and a lot of what had happened between Prometheus and Alien Covenant (Davids experiments) then Alien Awakening would certainly be a fitting name to the events that happened during the 10 years between Prometheus and Alien Covenant. But just because it sounds like it would fit.... and RS made that comment about the order being Prometheus, Awakening then Covenant.. does not mean that RS had made a slip up in the Order of things.
Alien Awakening is a name that also could suit Blomkamps Movie because indeed the idea was set 20+ years after the events of ALIENS (discounted Alien 3 on wards) so a with the Concept Works it does fit a movie where after 20 years the Company gets its hands on the Derelict and the Alien Re-awakens...
Some of the latter concept work, seems to have the name Red Harvest for Blomkamps Alien 5 and thats a Title that you could picture would fit a Alien Covenant Sequel... especially with the RS asking "what kind of a world would David Build" Certainly seemed the Covenant was to set up shop on Origae-6 and build a Cabin which means they would live a somewhat basic LIFE, and the Terraforming bay had a number of Machines for Farming the Land.... So indeed a Good Harvest would be needed for the Colony and a Red Harvest could indicate a Bloody Harvest... why maybe even we could ponder some kind of Wicker-Man Plot... where a Colonist is Sacrificed every year for a Better Harvest.
But these are just ways to think how that Title could relate to AC Sequel..... yet that working Title is for BLOMKAMPS Project.
So sometimes it hard to gauge things with RS.... is Alien Awakening or was it the Title for Covenants Sequel? It seems likely.. but then who knows.
I think regardless, it appears they was working on Drafts right until November 2017, but then this is when a combination of at First the Disappointing World Total Box Office came in, and then the period leading to Take Over Talks.
Katherine Waterston said she had heard some interesting rumors about her Character.... but then nothing for a while and so it would appear they had the Broad-strokes and they then was working on the Drafts... before things would have hit the breaks a little (Disappointing Box Office) and since the Take Over Talks/Battle its gone into Limbo.
Nov-17-2018 7:32 PM
I personally think RS has been a victim of his own success and style of film making. To clarify what I mean by this, I think it is worth looking at the style with which RS delivers a movie. He has always been great in the visual department and has always delivered on that. He also has a way of telling a story, and this I where I feel some things have become a little unstuck. Prometheus was an introductory movie pursuing a different avenue within the Alien universe. With the avoidance of Alien in the title it should have been clear that a xenomorph would not be present within the opening bars of this fresh performance. Fans aside, RS has a style that does not throw everything into the opening phrases of a new work. Things need to be established and scenes set before moving on into another section of the story. It is a kind of, one step at a time approach which creates a build up to something, but a build up to what?
Prometheus has great visuals and by the end of the movie has set up a situation to continue into another movie. Unfortunately, this is where I think the problems have started with the cinematic style of RS.
When looking through the back catalogue of the films RS has produced, it should be pain to see that his body of work is comprised of movies which have told a story through the duration of one movie. It would now appear that he has attempted to extend his style over the duration of a series of movies.
For me, AC is a bridging movie, but it also represents the second act of a three act movie. Just imagine watching only the middle third of Alien, and hopefully you may see what I am getting to. Many movies, because the entire story is contained within that one performance tend to have an end goal, and some sort of final objective. The end goal can shape the pace and entire tone of a movie as it is slowly revealed. With Prometheus and AC there is still no clear direction as to what this might be, But be aware that this is the style of RS, and it is usual for his best punch lines not to be too predictable.
Now I would say it is safe to say that RS had an idea for the end objective, and that there was a final script of sorts that could go into production. But something has happened. If a new movie was to come out now, would it lead onto anything else? Would that be it for the Alien franchise? Would we get one more movie and then the entire franchise is dead in the water?
It’s at this point where I feel that the whole programme has been under re-evaluation and maybe someone somewhere has said “ Change the end objective”.
This would now mean that there would have to be some new scripting and maybe title changes.
My guess is that because of the big change in who is now running things and box office performances, it is a bit like taking a car in for a regular service to be then told that the engine needs changing.
With regards to the Alien 5 project. If there is any truth in the idea that everything ends up on LV 426, then I think I can now understand the situation that came about resulting in Blomkamp dropping everything. Apparently it was considered that there was some small overlap in ideas. I am not buying that for one minute. If anyone is to take a close look at some of Blomkamp’s ideas, it can be seen that there was an idea of using technology to control xenomorphs. Now Blomkamp, it would appear would want to take the route of a xenogasmic battlefest, and have controlled xenomorphs. But just hold on there for a moment. RS stated that he wanted a war, and one of the most crucial scenes of AC I think is where David raises his arms with the new xenomorph , which is really in my book a statement about control.
Does’nt this leave a situation where you have two directors wanting a battlefest on the same topic ? Is there really room for two such movies? And ultimately is there a profit there from a beast that is supposed to be cooked ?
Nov-18-2018 12:26 PM
Looking at Blomkamps ideas we have to remember when Alien 5 was put on Hold we had Ridley Scott suggest that there was a few issues with that Idea that conflicted with how they planned to take the Sequels to Alien Covenant.
Blomkamps Alien 5 apart from being set some 20 years after ALIENS and in effect making Alien 3 and Alien R not happen. We have to remember at first his Alien 5 never even had Ripley and Hicks and Newt, it was only after working on Chappie and talking to Miss Weaver he decided to make the Plot around bringing those Characters back.
If we take out Ripley from his Concept works, what we still see is the Company (a Oriental One) had obtained a Engineer Ship (maybe the Derelict) and we see the Plot would have introduced alternative Xenomorph Designs, but also Re-introduce a Aliens Xenomorph Queen and then we would also had seen Engineer/Space Jockey Tech being used by a Human (Ripley) and then we saw another concept piece which i dont think was acknowledged as part of Blomkamps works which showed Humans Attempting to Remote Control Xenomorphs.
More Recently there was concepts for Project Blue Harvest (Alien 5) which indeed seemed to indicate that the Idea would have been Experiments and Re-Engineering of the Xenomorph to Create Hybrids and also attempt to Combine them with Technology to Control them. Just as you pointed out Batchpool
I actually think the Plot and concepts are interesting and maybe could be the MOVIE that more Fans would pay $$$$ to go and see... but i feel his Idea SHOULD-NOT have to Reboot Alien 3 and it SHOULD-NOT have Ripley in it.
Indeed it seemed Alien Awakening could have been the Title of Blomkamps Alien 5, but there is some confusion because Ridley Scott has said a few times its the Title of the Next Movie which we have to assume means the Sequel to Alien Covenant.
"And ultimately is there a profit there from a beast that is supposed to be cooked ?"
I think as RS has stated that there is not much more you can keep doing with the same old Xenomorph Formula... This does not mean you cant-not introduce different versions, and indeed Experiments etc would offer something a bit different and RS had said you can EVOLVE HIM...
I think the Sinister Agenda behind WHO would Create the Xenomorph and WHO would exploit the Xenomorph and WHY are the things that RS felt was needed to be explored more. As there is only so much you can do with Humans Stumbling across Eggs and seeing Queens Laying Eggs... even if we see Humans being Held against their Will to be used as Hosts or a Queen being captive to produce Eggs.. we have seen this in Alien Resurrection.
I think the Failed Clones and Experimentation Plot was more interesting to expand upon.
Nov-18-2018 12:28 PM
"there was a few issues with that Idea that conflicted with how they planned to take the Sequels to Alien Covenant."
Cant Edit: What i meant was Planned Sequels to Prometheus AKA Alien Covenant ;)
Nov-18-2018 12:36 PM
Regarding what state the Prequels are in now, a lot depends on IF Disney feel it warrants a investment.... I am not sure they are so concerned with leaving their Franchise Prequels Unfinished.... it could leave a bit of Mystery... were those not pleased with the Direction or in Denial over it can still look at the Franchise and think..... At least we have NO Proof 100% that David created the Eggs on the Derelict and that the Space Jockey had not been on LV-426 for Thousands of Years.
I worry the only way we would see a Movie would be IF we see Disney License out the Movie Franchise. They give companies like Dark Horse License to Produce Comics, Titan Books for Novels and various Games Companies for Producing Computer/Console Games.
I dont think Disney will SELL the Franchise because they can make a % from Licensing it out.
When dealing with a Movie they would have to consider what would Prevent Fans from Watching a Alien Covenant Sequel, what they was not pleased with. And WOULD any Movies they Produce or License out have a Positive or Negative Impact on the Franchise and how it is seen and its Reputation.
Nov-19-2018 7:24 AM
Scott seems to say a lot of things so I am not sure what really is going on and or how long they have gone at the project. Reliable sources close to the studio? I would like to know what those sources are otherwise it could be anything. Sorry but I am picky about those kind of things.
“If there is no script then good, it is better to take its time to make sure that it is a good script.
Was Scott misleading us by hyping up a sequel whose script was not even completed?”
I don’t know, maybe he was just throwing out some idea that he has.
“We're reaching out to our own studio sources for clarification...”
I do not care about what world that David would build, it is too much about him already. He could build a new Disneyland, what ever.
As far as what Batchpool’s post is concerned, keep Scott away from the story. He is not a writer, which is what we can see when he mentions that it should be about David. Like Batchpool says he is good with the visuals and that is mainly what I think that he should stick to.
Blomkamp could do his movie as long as he does not recon Alien 3. I would probably watch it but maybe there exist people that are interested in it.
“ At least we have NO Proof 100% that David created the Eggs on the Derelict and that the Space Jockey had not been on LV-426 for Thousands of Years.”
At least that is better than the crappy idea that David created the Xeno.
“When dealing with a Movie they would have to consider what would Prevent Fans from Watching a Alien Covenant Sequel...”
I can only speak for myself but to me the problems are that it is all about David, David as the supposed creator of the Xeno, and mostly lame human characters.
Nov-20-2018 3:27 AM
All this confusion can be unraveled with some common sense...
Considering that Fox CEO Stacey Snider, to Variety I believe, said about Ridley Scott knowing the right story when he finds it was said after we first heard news of Ridley's AI/War-of-the-Worlds/Engineer pitch seems to suggest that Ridley and his writers may have pitched that idea as either a treatment or draft but it was turned down by Fox who, after Alien: Covenant's less than stellar box office performance, wanted a smaller scale sequel, at least in terms of budget.
Since then the only news we have heard moving forward is the rumor that we may be getting a small screen serial set in the Alien universe. Beyond that, all Alien movie news has just been speculation and repetition.
Alien: Awakening, be it Neill Blomkamp's Alien 5 (or more correctly Alien 3: Version 2) or Ridley's Alien: Covenant 2, never had a final, green lit script. Though interestingly it seems Blomkamp's movie, which originally had the title, looks to have been further developed considering the wealth of concept art we have seen. Blomkamp's movie was considered, but that was before Ridley urged Fox to support Covenant instead.
Following Alien: Covenant and The Predator's poor box office and critical performance, and having recently been bought out by Disney, Fox WILL be reassessing their plans moving forward with both these franchises - trying to find a way to narratively correct the ship and regain the trust of the fandom while maximizing the possible investment-profit margin by looking to other entertainment mediums, such as the small screen.
Nov-20-2018 11:40 AM
I would like to continue with what Gavin was touching upon..
Indeed its hard to Gauge what Ridley Scott is on about, i think we have to take his word more than anyone else and it appears after the PLOT Direction and Set-up from Alien Covenant, its likely he and Logan had a idea of where this was going NEXT!
During interviews after the Release of AC we have RS suggesting they are working on the Draft as we Speak! He had even said that its DONE! and this can only mean the PLOT is done and its then in the Process of Logan turning it into a Draft... or that Logan had Finished his First Draft!
Ridley Scott even suggested that Shooting would start in so many Months and then xxx months the Movie would be released. (forget the numbers off my head) but it added up to a Release Date of about April 2019... Ridley Scott must be getting either TOO OLD or on too many Martinis ... unless there is a HIGH Element of Truth to how far the Project Was!
I think this is likely... but then once the Overall Box Office Numbers came in, and the Criticism about Alien Covenant and maybe lack of confidence from Fanbase in a Sequel... i am sure this is what caused FOX to Re-assess the Project!
Then after this we had the Take-Over Talks and FOX are not going to Green Light a Sequel they may have some Cold-Feet over in light especially when a Take Over is in the Process.
Stacey Snider comments seem to indicate that Overall those at FOX were not 100% sure the Plot that RS had for the sequel is quite the Right One to Proceed. They could not take a Punt on a Sequel if some Elements are not pleasing to a Majority of the Fan-base...
And then when Take-Over Talks kicked in, the Project would be on HOLD
Nov-20-2018 5:53 PM
Just don't think we'll receive a RS installment next for Alien. Disney bought a universe and they can do whatever they think will generate money (i.e. streaming series, movie, prime time series, etc.). AC was a stepping stone but Disney will choose if there is another step to take in the direction RS was going or not. I think they will proceed but just not clear what direction and with whom. At least they have the money to make it good.
Nov-21-2018 12:23 PM
I agree but i think the Prequels need Finishing, its just i am not sure a majority would want to see what AC2 may have been.
So i think as Alien Covenant in affect by-passed Prometheus 2, i think the Logical Step is to by-pass Alien Covenant 2 and arrive at AC3 or at least start from the Final Act of Alien Covenant 2. (incoming Parties).
The other expanded ideas for the Franchise that RS was more interested in rather than Xenomorphs, are maybe best to be covered in TV Series or Separate Movie ONCE we have the Prequel Event to ALIEN concluded (Provided this happens and does well or ok).
Similar to my latest post Alien Covenant 2 to take place on LV-426?
As i think AC2 particularly if its like what i have pondered in this Topic Alien: Exodus would simply be something a majority would NOT be interested in.... However in that Topic.. Ideas like Leto had put could be interesting to most fans and likely be what a AC3 may have covered and i feel this is the Safest Way to Go for Disney.
Nov-29-2018 8:29 AM
It would be strange if Disney would not keep in mind how AC performed. In a Way Alien Covenant deserved what it got because it is not a very good movie even though I wish that it was but at the same time it is not total crap. Honestly before I watched it I hoped that they had learned from Prometheus but they didn’t.
As far as the TV-series is concerned maybe they have a sort of confidence in it but maybe not as a full movie is concerned. They know that there is an audience but not an audience that is as big as to make a movie theater thing, how about that? I would rather have that than another movie about a mad android with weak human characters. Honestly I do not have any interest in the kind of thing that Scott wants to do (which would be more David, *sigh*).
Not interested in Blomkamp’s movie if it will retcon Alien 3.
To comment a bit on what Big Dave says, if they do not listen to the criticism then something would be very wrong but hopefully they try to listen and no the monsters were far from the main problem. I am just speaking for myself
“Just don't think we'll receive a RS installment next for Alien.” - RickT
If that would have been another David movie then I am not going to be sad if it will not be done. To add to this I got to say that I will not be sad if we never see any conclusion to the prequels, because, well, shit happens. All Scott has been saying is that well Xenomorph but then he says that
David will do this and David will do that bla bla bla. All that he cares about is David and I am not interested. He is an interesting character in a way but I do not want a movie about him which it seems that Scott wanted.