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Starting to understand the Disney Alien canon...

Starting to understand the Disney Alien canon...

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ninXeno426

PraetorianMember3070 XPApr-03-2022 5:20 PM

As we all know roughly 10 years ago Disney purchased Star Wars from George Lucas and by 2014 they had confirmed they were doing away with the old expanded universe in favor of their own. The reason was that they didn't want to to task new authors with getting to know absolutely everything about the beloved universe. Real reason more likely they probably felt they couldn't make as much money off of pre existing storylines and what better way to make more money than throw it all away and make your own. Force fans (no pun intended I swear) into buying new novels, comics and games to get to know the new universe. Now how successful that has been is up for debate but that's not what I'm here to talk about. I believe Alien is about to undergo the same treatment.

Last year Disney began their first real forays into the Alien universe beginning with Marvel's Alien. This comic takes place in the 2202, twenty three years after the events of Aliens and Alien 3. Also Aliens Fireteams Elite takes place the same year. A one shot comic titled Aliens Aftermath that follows Jennette Vasquez's Nephew Cutter Vasquez takes place in 2214. But here is where it gets interesting. 

In an interview with Bloody Disgusting, comic author Philip Kennedy Johnson discussed working on the series and a potential new timeline. I'll provide the link below in case you haven't read it

https://bloody-disgusting.com/interviews/3662868/writer-phillip-kennedy-johnson-marvels-alien-can-expect-new-comics-blood-ink-staples/

Now in this interview he talks how working on a new canon where Alien 3 and Resurrection have been discarded. He says here and I quote:

"The ones that, for me, are potentially on the canon chopping block are Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection, and of course all the AVP stuff. I’m treating those as not canon, at least not in my own head canon as a fan. Now Alien 3 is super debatable, and I actually like that movie a lot. I think there are a lot of things about that movie that are super kickass. The big problem with it, of course, is that Newt and Hicks are killed offscreen for no reason right out of the gate.

And that sucks. We’ve learned to love those characters by that point, and then we just completely undo all of that. That makes the story revolve around Ripley, as it should, but it does really suck for the fans who learned to love those characters. And because of that perceived betrayal of the fans, you’ve got these other versions of the stories out there. One of those first comic stories show Newt and Hicks later in life, which wipes Alien 3 and Alien Resurrection off the board if you regard that comic as true. And there’s the screenplay that’s come out since then, the other version of Alien 3. So I feel like that’s where the timeline diverges, and you can kind of choose your own adventure at that point.

Honestly, this was one of the reasons why I didn’t want to refer to Alien 3 or Resurrection at all in this first arc, because I think there’s a decent chance that canon could be retconned at some point, and it’s important to me that these Marvel books always remain canon, always."

End quote.

Now feelings towards Alien 3 and Resurrection are mixed and always will be. He even makes his own disdain for Resurrection known at the beginning of the interview. But so are the prequels. They're arguably even more mixed than those two films. His reasoning for retconning the ladder films is silly, reason being Prometheus and Covenant discarded comics that were never technically canon anyway. It got me thinking the though, since it was so easy for Disney to throw away 20 plus years of Star Wars stories to tell their own is it so hard to believe they would delete to fairly unpopular and divisive films? As of now Kennedy makes it clear this is really just his canon but I think it is the beginning of a larger move to create a new canon where 3 and Resurrection don't exist. This June a new comic from Johnson that acts as a prequel to the Marvel series drops and apparently has significant ties to Aliens Fireteams Elite as well. Now I don't know where the new film will take place yet but we do know that the Hulu series will take place earlier in the timeline than any film. And with Ridley Scott producing I think it's safe to say Prometheus and Covenant aren't being discarded though as I said they're arguably more divisive than Alien 3 and Resurrection. 

Personally I don't care for things being retconned though it'll certainly please some. It's lazy and unimaginative and all in the name of casual fan pandering. What Alien needs is something new. Not more of the same. In both canon and non canon we have gotten plenty of great stories surrounding Ripley, Hicks, Newt, Bishop etc. If these movies are retconned then how long before we have to see cgi deaged actors? Star Wars is obsessed with relieving the past so again it's not too hard to believe Alien will go this route as well. Even now they're showing an inability to distance themselves from the past with what is basically a Vasquez origins novel being revealed. Alien has been dangerously on the rocks for years and now I think it's closer than ever to being beached. 

What Alien is needs is fresh new stories and characters. Not more of the same. On one hand I'm thankful that the new movie is standalone. On the other I'm fearful it won't deviate much if at all from the standard formula. Prometheus and Covenant for all their worts and wrinkles (I personally love both) opened the universe in fascinating and exiting new ways. Hell when I played Fireteams the segments I enjoyed the most was where it dabbled in prequel territory. Alien is starting to feel just as stuck as Star Wars. I guess we'll see. How do you all feel about this potential new canon? One where events of Alien 3 don't happen and by proxy neither does Resurrection. Would you rather Disney make a new film with those characters much like Neill Blomkamp attempted not too long ago. Or do you feel much like me that everything is becoming to 'Memberberry. Far too focused on nostalgia. Would you rather more prequel era lore or perhaps a new timeline overall? One where maybe just Alien and Aliens exist? I personally want all 6 main films to remain canon (everything but the AVP's) and I hope it stays that way. New content from Disney hasn't exactly been engaging. But what do you all think? Share your thoughts below and sorry about so long a post.

 

   

 

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

34 Responses to Starting to understand the Disney Alien canon...

ifox

OvomorphMember63 XPApr-03-2022 10:25 PM

I think that between the new novels and the RPG, there is a lot going for the "new canon." The RPG does not throw away Alien 3, btw. It acknowledges the xenomorph itself from the movie and uses the idea of the Starbeast "novel" by Robert Morse, originally mentioned, I think, in the Weyland-Yutani Report.

I am particularly fond of the direction that the novels by Alex White (The Cold Forge and Into Charybdis) have taken. They are both really excellent reads and also follow the general trends in the new canon. They bring in the political aspects - the UA, 3WE, UPP, and ICSC, and the corporate aspects - particularly the WYU vs Seegson stuff. Into Charybdis even ties into Prometheus very briefly. They also do some really startling things with the "black goo" from Prometheus and Covenant.

As for the comics, I am buying the new Marvel stuff, but I see very little real effort to stick to the canon of the RPG and novels, especially in the second arc and in the Aftermath comic. I am starting to feel like the Marvel comics are what some here have referred to as "fluff."

One thing I DO like though is the continued and even expanded use of some of the better characters from the old Dark Horse days, like Zula Hendricks from Defiance, who has also featured in the novel Prototype. Its also nice to see the new novels using Amanda Ripley from Isolation and Olivia Shipp from Echo. All of these are great characters that continue the legacy of Ellen Ripley as a strong female sci-fi character. I believe Olivia even shows up in Fireteam Elite, though I have yet to play it.

I would love to see Blue Marsalis from the Alex White novels return as she is probably my favorite Alien/s character at this point, and is certainly the most surprising.

I actually think that what I have seen of the "new canon" is very promising (minus the lackluster marvel comics). I personally don't care if they retcon Resurrection, but I guess we will have to see what happens. The Alien universe has a lot of potential for growth and expansion, particularly if the authors and directors, going forward, lean into the political and corporate aspects.

Xenotaris

PraetorianMember3266 XPApr-03-2022 11:11 PM

yeah Dark Horse where really good at writing ALIEN comics. I although as much as I want Newt, Hicks and Ripley being retconned back to life... In the end it would be a terrible idea for the Alien cinematic universe. It would open a door to retcon more stuff which would ruin the alien movies.

ALIEN VERSUS PREDATOR UNIVERSE

robertopupka

OvomorphMember13 XPApr-05-2022 3:49 AM

Dark horse so good)

Man Zzz..

BigDave

DeaconMember10324 XPApr-05-2022 5:57 AM

"Real reason more likely they probably felt they couldn't make as much money off of pre existing storylines"

This REALLY is the case......as in they know that the MAJORITY would view ALIENS as the BIGGEST of the Franchise and so to have 4 Major Characters all KILLED OFF by the TIME we Finish ALIEN 3, had Disappointed many Fans.

They was then STUCK as FAR as HOW can you continue after ALIEN 3, you need the Xenomorph, but what is a ALIEN MOVIE without Ripley and HENCE we got the PLOT for Alien Resurrection.... simply Because they Struggle to think of NEW THINGS and Worry that you have to have RIPLEY to SELL!

Blomkamps 2 Alien V Projects and the Walter Hill/David Giler version of their Alien V all had Ripley in and so would De-Canon those Movies (Alien 3/Alien R).

And so with the Novels/Comics we have seen Stories which would Remove Alien 3 etc from Canon....  Personally i think Ripleys Story was TOLD in the First 4 Movies you have the OPTION of Continue with her in a ALIEN R sequel... but that Movie was a bit of a Disappointment.... and even so i think they should LEAVE her Story as it was.

It sucks that Newt got Killed but the ONLY option would have been to SET the Plot of ALIEN 3 like 6-7 Years latter as well at the TIME that Alien 3 was Shooting then Carrie Henn was 15...... UNLESS they Cast another 9-10 Year Old to Play her.

Hicks i can Understand why some would be UPSET... i dont know why Michael Biehn could not have been Cast/Written into a ALIEN 3 and then Ripley Dies (Miss Weaver wanted out) and the Torch could have been PASSED to Hicks.

But as FAR as Comics/Novels such is the Fondness for these Characters that its NO WONDER that some Novels/Comics will COVER them and IGNORE the 3rd Movie as Canon.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

DeaconMember10324 XPApr-05-2022 6:25 AM

"So I feel like that’s where the timeline diverges, and you can kind of choose your own adventure at that point."

This was ALSO the way that Neil Blomkamp looked at his ALIEN V it would give us TWO ALTERNATIVE Continuations to ALIENS.  So Fans can enjoy either, or Reject One in Favor of the other. I THINK this is what PKJ is on about in Terms of the Comics/Novels and Video Games...

"What Alien needs is something new. Not more of the same"

NinXeno426 i Totally agree....

Especially as FAR as having to Re-Tread with Familiar Characters, even if its just to Connect to a Family Member (Amanda) i am NOT SURE you have to KEEP doing this..... The BIGGER PLAYERS in the Franchise have to be the Company and WHY they have such a Interest in the Xenomorphs, and Engineers.  I would say A.I has its Role, and you have to have something that is Related to the Xenomorph....

You do-not Need the same Company but the Story has to be about WHY and WHERE and WHEN we get Humans who get themselves into Trouble with the Horrors the Engineers had Created.... and to WHY did this Happen.... and having a A.I or Company behind it with their own AGENDA is what Drives the PLOT/STORY.

You then have to CREATE and Flesh Out like New Characters and IF they are Well Written and Executed then you DO-NOT need to have the Old Cast or Relatives of them become Involved.

The BROADER PLOT of Prometheus does OPEN-UP the Franchise to a MUCH LARGER UNIVERSE and Scope....

But i think that DISNEY will PLAY it SAFE and will NOT go and Diverge too FAR from what we had before.... so it will be some LV-XXX World, it will have Eggs, Face Huggers and a MONSTER that will STAY VERY CLOSE to what we saw in the Franchise.... and YES i think they will TRY to Connect to Characters from the Original Movies and Especially the First Two.

So their Vision is Limited and we will be STUCK within the Small Confines of the BOX that was ALIEN/ALIENS.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Thoughts_Dreams

NeomorphMember1591 XPApr-05-2022 8:47 AM

Maybe I'll make some disappointed when I say this but here it goes - I've never seen the alien-story being about Ripley having a family and everything being about a happy ending and whatever. If you want positivity and a happy ending you can check out other franchises. Here bad things happen and people die (Alien anyone?) so deal with it. Even the AVP's and the prequels were never about that so the majority are in line with the first one.

I think that he's totally wrong about Hicks and Newt being killed off. They did the right decision IMO. Comics to me don't count since they're not official material, the movies are and the rest is fiction if you ask me.

“What Alien needs is something new. Not more of the same.”

This, I would like to see new worlds, new monsters, maybe new corporations and how they try to screw each-other over. Characters that are not tied to anyone that came before would be welcomed, they need to be well-written and executed.

The prequels are mixed but at least they tried something new. Give me new movies and new characters, more of the same would be boring.

“Would you rather more prequel era lore or perhaps a new timeline overall?"

I would say keep what was good in the prequels. I liked the Engineers, the black goo and the idea of new monsters. Developing the Engineers is my biggest wish if we shall talk about things that should be kept and developed from the prequels. 1, 2, and 3 are those that matter to me but the rest is from average (AVP, AR, and the prequels) to really bad (AVPR).

Ripley should have stayed dead after Alien 3, they made a mockery out of that character in AR. Hicks, what should his role have been in a prison planet? Maybe they could have gone with another story but I don't miss that character in Alien 3.

“The BROADER PLOT of Prometheus does OPEN-UP the Franchise to a MUCH LARGER UNIVERSE and Scope.…”

Very much so if you ask me. Just because Prometheus was a disappointment doesn't mean that you got to throw everything away that it introduced. It opened up the alien-universe so it didn't become about running away from the Xeno for the 100th time.

“and YES i think they will TRY to Connect to Characters from the Original Movies and Especially the First Two.”

Oh please no, that would be boring

Xenotaris

PraetorianMember3266 XPApr-05-2022 11:15 AM

They could always canonize Billie and Wilks, (Newt's and Hick's replacements from the rewrites of the Earth War trilogy)

ALIEN VERSUS PREDATOR UNIVERSE

Thoughts_Dreams

NeomorphMember1591 XPApr-05-2022 11:55 AM

Xenotaris: Why use old characters? I would rather see new ones

VOGT

OvomorphMember11 XPApr-05-2022 5:12 PM

They should bring it back to being more a horror franchise primarily, rather than an action one, but they need to have various different plotlines. Also, I think there is a place for spinoff scoi-fi stories set in the same verse but without the aliens born from the black goo. Maybe use the unused Alien design by Ron Cobb in an interesting plotline as that is a wasted design for an extraterrestrial. Make them distinct enough from the xenomorph-XX121and make the blot not just an 'ALIEN' clone.

ninXeno426

PraetorianMember3070 XPApr-06-2022 1:41 PM

So much to respond to...

I'll start with ifox: I agree with these new Marvel comics being mediocre. I'd probably actually say they're abysmal lol. I quit reading them after three issues of the second ark. Aliens Fireteams Elite does indeed tie to Alien Echo. That slipped my mind mainly because I haven't read Echo. I'm aware of the amount of universe building that the rpg has done but I haven't played it. Ultimately I'm curious if Disney would care enough to consider that canon though. I don't think Alien really has anyone that over See's Alien continuity like Star Wars has. I think the closest we get is Ridley Scott who's vision is inconsistent to say the least. He mainly cares about his films and at least respects Aliens. 

But I do think Disney will at least canonize some things much like Star Wars. I forgot to say Alien Isolation still seems to matter somewhat with Seegson playing a very minor role in Fireteams.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

ninXeno426

PraetorianMember3070 XPApr-06-2022 1:46 PM

Xenotaris I see a huge demand for the Earth War trilogy to be adapted but I don't know why. Nothing against the stories mind you but what is the point in adapting 30+ year old plots that we know oh so well? Not to mention Disney would likely scoff at the budget required to see those brought to life. As for me personally I don't really want to see a large scale apocalyptic scenario. It's maybe natural but ultimately predictable.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

ninXeno426

PraetorianMember3070 XPApr-06-2022 2:02 PM

Thoughts_Dreams I 100% agree with you on the decisions made by Alien 3. It never bothered me. These things killed everyone and everything Ripley knew. If James Cameron kept obviously this wouldn't have happened. Maybe he would have killed some one off but In a more emotional send off (Like Uncle Bob in T2) but this Alien. To hell with the sappy sentiment. It's a dark and uninviting universe and people want a happily ever after ending?

As for companies I think that's a place they are heading. Alien Isolation introduced Seegson and Fireteams Elite mentioned a couple other companies I believe and the tv series is introducing yet another company as well judging from what little has been said about it.

Ultimately I'd like the series to get away from the corporate trappings. Been there, done that. They're always the same. I'd prefer to pursue the engineers further.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

ninXeno426

PraetorianMember3070 XPApr-06-2022 2:16 PM

They was then STUCK as FAR as HOW can you continue after ALIEN 3, you need the Xenomorph, but what is a ALIEN MOVIE without Ripley and HENCE we got the PLOT for Alien Resurrection.... simply Because they Struggle to think of NEW THINGS and Worry that you have to have RIPLEY to SELL!

As always BigDave I agree. Nostalgia always sells better... supposedly. The Declining box office of Terminator and even Star Wars show putting those actors as those characters on the big screen again doesn't guarantee success. You need a good movie to support them which is rarely the case. For every Blade Runner 2049 there is a Terminator Dark Fate (I personally thought is was alright but most did not)

I am honestly surprised that this new film is stand alone and not an excuse to bring Ripley, Hicks, and Newt back, but that doesn't mean they won't do it. They more than likely will especially if what I'm assuming is right and 3 and Resurrection have been deleted. Especially if this new film is a success as well as most Alien fans are simply just fans of the first two films. There is still a huge demand for Blomkamp's film to be made. Now I don't think they'll do his but it wouldn't surprise me on bit if they do something akin to it especially if they say attach James Cameron as a writer/producer. It's sadly more guaranteed to make money than a more ambitious project that doesn't follow established Alien norms...

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

ninXeno426

PraetorianMember3070 XPApr-06-2022 2:28 PM

I also have to add this. A new Alien film retconning previous ones isn't necessarily a bad thing as long as the results are worth it. The previous Alien films came first and will always matter to me more but I can accept a new timeline as long as it's worth my time. My DVDs aren't going anywhere. You can't actually takes those films away from me. Same goes with other franchises I'm a fan off like Halloween which has multiple timelines. And while I enjoy some of Disney Star Wars such as The Mandalorian I still prefer to visit the now Legends material.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

BigDave

DeaconMember10324 XPApr-06-2022 6:52 PM

"Maybe I'll make some disappointed when I say this but here it goes - I've never seen the alien-story being about Ripley having a family and everything being about a happy ending and whatever"

Ripleys Story was our Proxy to the Franchise, she had her Story and i thought with ALIEN 3 she had the Right Conclusion it was a Fitting END and we have to Remember it was Miss Weaver who wanted to be KILLED OFF.

So that CONCLUDED the Franchise at the TIME..... until they wanted to make a ALIEN 4, which when we looked at the Trilogy it seemed the Xenomorph was Encountered on LV-426..... Ripley had Survived but was Floating in Space for 57 Years and she tried to WARN the Company about LV-426 where they then said its OK we have a Colony there for SOME TIME.... its only after the Co-Ordinates are given to Hadleys Hope that we get our 2nd Encounter via the Jordens.  We conclude with Hadleys Hope being NUKED and we ASSUME thats the END of the Xenomorph.

We get to ALIEN 3 and they come up with some Plot about EGGS getting on the Sulaco, and then DISCOVERING that Ripley is Impregnated the Company are Contacted.... we CONCLUDE with Ripley Sacrificing herself to STOP the Company getting the Xenomorph and we have to ASSUME this left the Company with NO WAY to Obtain them!

HENCE the Obtain a Specimen via Cloning Ripley some 200 Years latter PLOT... they Felt you NEED the Xenomorph in a ALIEN MOVIE and i would Agree at that TIME, but they also FELT you NEEDED to get Ripley back some how....

WHAT they FAILED to look at after ALIEN 3 was the Following.

1) Was the Derelict on LV-426 the ONLY SHIP like it with the Same/Similar Cargo in the Galaxy?

2) Where was the Xenomorph Obtained by the Space Jockey?  A Creation, Experiment on something else, or Obtained as they were from some other WORLD?

But they seemed to NOT have much Ideas, or the Balls to TRY a Movie where you DONT have to bring back RIPLEY!

And so WHEN looking to Explore the Franchise then YES i dont see WHY you have to think you NEED to have Ripley back...... but seems that THOSE who are in Charge and others who COME UP with ideas, seem to think its PLAYING IT SAFE to bring back Ripley (Various Alien V ideas).

With Star Wars you can Explore a Character who had DIED, by looking at their Past...... Sadly you cant do that with RIPLEY if a ALIEN MOVIE does-not have any Xenomorphs or Related.... and i think it would be SILLY to have a STORY thats Set before ALIEN or between ALIEN-ALIENS with Ripley and Xenomorphs.

It will be Interesting to SEE what the MOVIE would be About and WHAT kind of Connections it makes to the Franchise, the same can be said with the TV Series (which i think will CONFLICT the Franchise).

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

DeaconMember10324 XPApr-06-2022 7:16 PM

"I think that he's totally wrong about Hicks and Newt being killed off"

I already mentioned that Miss Weaver wanted to be KILLED OFF, and i had Mentioned before that you could NOT go and Continue with NEWT unless you either had the STORY set say 7 Years after ALIENS or you Re-Cast some other 10 Year Old to PLAY NEWT.

However i cant see WHY they had to KILL OFF the Character Hicks... but whats DONE is DONE and i dont think any of these Characters should be BROUGHT BACK!

But saying that.... with Novels and Comics it allows for them to Bring Back Characters or Expand the Franchise that may Conflict the Movies, and with these Comics/Novels if these Stories do-not Interest you then Fans can Choose to IGNORE them..... while others can Choose to Enjoy them....

I see them as Alternative Realities.

I think that when it comes down to ALIEN... then the Xenomorph was ALIEN but so was the SPACE JOCKEY.  With the ADVENT of the Prequels and Especially with PROMETHEUS....

The Xenomorph was ALIEN, we had LV-426 and the Derelict, and so by Extension then LV-223 is ALIEN, the Experiments on LV-223 and Black Goo is ALIEN and the Engineers are ALIEN.

Ridley Scott had taken the Franchise out of the BOX.... and Neil Blomkamp would likely had PLACED it back in the Box (Derelict from LV-426, Alien 3 does-not Exist and Ripley is back some 25 Years latter).

I have said MANY TIMES that we NEED to look beyond that SMALL BOX of what 50LY where ALIEN had taken Place etc...

1)Do we assume that Earth is the ONLY place that had Humans say prior to the year 2000 lets say?

2) Is Earth/Humans the ONLY Species like us the Engineers had Created, Evolved and Visited?

3) Are the Engineers ONLY on Planet 4 and LV-223?

4) Is LV-223 the ONLY Outpost of the Engineers where they Conduct such Experiments?

5) Have the Engineers Tested or USED the Bio-Weapons on other Worlds? if so WHY and WHAT had became of these!

6) Was the Derelict the ONLY Ship to have such a Cargo?

7) WHY cant we have a Spin-Off thats either SET in a FAR FAR AWAY place? Or other Galaxy?  Or even in the PAST?

The Last One is Important because we can have Humans in the PAST or FAR FAR AWAY and Connect to the Characters.... do they Speak English?

Well WHY do we have Humans in Star Wars in a Galaxy Far Far Away, who Speak English by Coincidence?

No its because we seem to Connect more with Human Characters and they Speak English for our CONVENIENCE!

And so WHY cant we do the same with ALIEN?  take BSG/Caprica... other Human Colonies who are FAR from Earth..... I think its Arrogant to Assume that in Context to Prometheus that Mankind was Created on Earth!

The Engineers could have Brought us to Earth.... maybe without the Knowledge of the REST of their Kind?

Or maybe the Engineers could have TAKEN some of us in the PAST to other Worlds?  The Problem comes when we TRY and do such Stories... some Fans will be like... WHERE IS THE XENOMORPH?

You cant have a ALIEN MOVIE without them?   But the THING that Ridley Scott was trying to to was OPEN the Franchise to a SPIN OFF Series.

You can have that... but you can also do something NEW... we cant think the Engineers are ONLY INTERESTED in Black Goo Horrors, Xenomorphs and the like!

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

ifox

OvomorphMember63 XPApr-10-2022 8:43 PM

ninXeno426 - Andrew Gaska is the person who has been keeping the Alien canon bible. I don't know to what extent he has been working with Disney so far, but I believe he has been consulted on recent novels and games, and he has written much of the RPG.

I finally bought Fireteam Elite. I hesitated for a long time because I don't care for co-op games and because the reviews were pretty mixed. I am playing it solo, which is challenging but not as much as I thought it would be. I have found it to be a much, much better experience than I expected. It is drawing from the first three movies, Prometheus, Alien Echo, the tie in novel Infiltrator, and the RPG (quite a lot actually, particularly with reference to the Frontier War), and generally does a GREAT job with the "new" cannon. The lore aspect is probably the best part, in fact. Parts of the game take place in Engineer ruins, and its great to see the introduction of these aspects into the Alien gaming universe. My only complaint, lore-wise, so far, has been the repeated statement that humans have not encountered intelligent beings in the alien universe. Both the movies and the RPG have mentioned the Arcturians, the RPG going further in the development of this aspect. I feel like they missed a little bit there. Otherwise, its pretty great.

Morik

OvomorphMember11 XPApr-10-2022 9:00 PM

Do we have a list of what all Andrew Gaska considers canon?

Xenotaris

PraetorianMember3266 XPApr-11-2022 6:04 AM

I was saying reviving Billie and Wilks as characters, not adaptate the Earth War but hey it that might end up being a bad idea.

ALIEN VERSUS PREDATOR UNIVERSE

ninXeno426

PraetorianMember3070 XPApr-11-2022 4:54 PM

See with Fireteams ignoring Arcturians is what I mean about Alien canon being spotty and inconsistent. It feels like most people that get assigned a project don't always take everything seriously much like the Marvel comics where he openly admits to retconning Alien 3 and Resurrection. I wish someone had stopped him from doing that. No one did.

Fireteams was average to me. Better than Colonial Marines but ultimately unremarkable. Just another generic horde shooter. I do appreciate the lore, it shows the developers care more about a consistent universe than Marvel does. Marvel feels like glorified fan fiction 

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

Xenotaris

PraetorianMember3266 XPApr-12-2022 5:37 AM

Fireteam's story was very lackluster, between the dropship pilot threatening to blow you up/abandoning you if you miss the ETA and the mission control lady being very panicky and the NARM lore tidbits the REQ Officer spouts about how cartoonishly evil the Weyland Yutani Corporation is.

Olivia Shipp's marines lacked discipline and were little more than space pirates at this point. Say what you will comparing Gorman's troops but at least Gorman had the excuse of being an inexperienced Lieutenant manipulated by a corporate agent

ALIEN VERSUS PREDATOR UNIVERSE

ifox

OvomorphMember63 XPApr-14-2022 12:08 AM

Fireteam Elite is very video-gamey. It almost feels like a retro arcade game in the way it forces you to start over if you die in a particular way. Insert coin, start again. The number of aliens is ridiculous.

All of that said, I guess I just consider a video game a video game. I've played AVP, AVP 2, AVP 2010, Colonial Marines, Isolation, Blackout, and Fireteam. I don't think Fireteam is particularly amazing as a video game, though it beats Colonial Marines. But I do like that it brings in some elements from other parts of the canon. I liked moving through the Prometheus inspired bits. And, generally, I thought it was fun. Not ground breaking by any means, but fun. I'm still about 4 missions from the end and still enjoying. But its going to be different mileage for everyone. I always wait until things are patched and on sale before I buy, and by then I've seen the reviews and have my expectations lowered adequately.

I've also read all of the novels, and this too has lead me to temper expectations. Some of them are fantastic, some of them are awful. In general, I have enjoyed them all in their own way.

Kapkhronic

OvomorphMember11 XPApr-14-2022 1:06 AM

Honestly you said it better then I ever will. 
all I know is if I do t get to see riddley Scott’s ending to Prometheus I’m gonna end up extremely heart broken. I found myself looking him up earlier today…. My man’s 84 yikes I really want him to be giving free rain to make as much alien stuff as possible before you know what happens. Let him go out like 2pac  

Xenotaris

PraetorianMember3266 XPApr-14-2022 5:36 AM

ifox

I mean Aliens versus Predator 2 and Alien Isolation have phenomenal story telling that pays respects to the prosperities they are based on, so just because its a video game that doesn't give the developers an excuse to be half-assed with their stories.

I hold AVP2 in high regards because its what reignited my interest in both the ALIEN and PREDATOR series since 2003

ALIEN VERSUS PREDATOR UNIVERSE

BigDave

DeaconMember10324 XPApr-14-2022 6:53 AM

"My only complaint, lore-wise, so far, has been the repeated statement that humans have not encountered intelligent beings in the alien universe.

Both the movies and the RPG have mentioned the Arcturians"

I think it Depends on the TIME-LINE... now we had Encountered Engineers before 2100 but maybe any Information about them was KEPT like TOP SECRET.

By the TIME we get to ALIENS then Humans have had Contact it would seem Quite a Lot with the Arcturians.  But nothing much was given about them in the Movie, i would always had wanted to see them Explored, i had Read they was Explored in a Game before?  And Described as Insect like..... thats a COP OUT if you ask me.

It would be Interesting to see what the RPG says about them.

While on this Subject (ALIENS)  we learn that they have NEVER encountered anything like the Xenomorph before in all their Surveyed Worlds... but i GUESS this could be PUT DOWN to a COVER UP.... but the more that Canon is Changed so we have MANY MORE ENCOUNTERS... it Really begins to CONFLICT that NOTION from ALIENS.

By the TIME we get to 2150-2200 its likely that we would have Encountered Various  Species.... both Intelligent and Monstrous.

The Prometheus Plot opens up a GALAXY of Many Races and Horrors which we have YET to Scratch the Surface with.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

DeaconMember10324 XPApr-14-2022 7:07 AM

@Kapkhronic

I agree its Unfortunate that RS had NEVER got to Explore his Plans, which had been Changed Quite a LOT from Prequel to Prequel by the POWERS THAT BE!

Ridley Scott had seen more Potential in the Engineers and WHAT ELSE they have Created and Been up to.... rather than just to Concentrate on them having those EGGS and WHY.  He seemed to FEEL that ONCE you had Explained as to WHERE/HOW/WHEN those Eggs got on the Derelict.... its WHAT THEN?

It seems that after doing this (Earlier Prequel Drafts) then what do you do then?  More Eggs, Face Huggers, Chest Bursters etc?  And so their Involvement with HOW we have Eggs was just ONE THING.... there is more to Mankind than Gunpowder and its Various uses in WAR/WEAPONRY... there is MORE to Mankind than that...... where the Reasons for WHY we have CONFLICTS is more Important than WHAT we USE to Deal with them.

Prometheus had GIVEN us enough Clues but it was NOT SPOON FED and you had to USE your Brain a bit... but also it was Ambiguous to was STILL a Mystery Box.

Prometheus wanted to MOVE AWAY from ALIEN... but it could NOT do so Because it NEVER GAVE enough Answers and NEVER had any Monsters on Screen Long Enough to Relate to ALIEN.... and so the Sequel had became SHACKLED to ALIEN and the Xenomorph.

I dont think we will see the Completion of what RS may have wanted to SHOW....

But ONCE the Xenomorph has been MILKED too DEATH.... i think we will see more Variations of other Monsters from the Black Goo and maybe even MORE kinds of Species in the GALAXY as the PROMETHEUS PLOT had HUGE SCOPE!

At the Moment the Xenomorph is Synonymous with the Franchise, its what is Recognized as the Franchise, and its WHAT SELLS..... but i agree there is so MUCH more that can be Explored within Context to ALIEN via Virtue of the Engineers Plot.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Xenotaris

PraetorianMember3266 XPApr-14-2022 12:33 PM

"It would be Interesting to see what the RPG says about them."

They are featured in the Alien RPG: Colonial Marine Operations Manual and are broken down into two distinct species.

The Arcturians proper are what were described in ALIENS being humanoid and all, possibly an engineer seed species.

And the Arctura, an anthropodal simian that inhabits the same world as the humanoids. A blue monkey with a horn in the center of its forehead.

ALIEN VERSUS PREDATOR UNIVERSE

ninXeno426

PraetorianMember3070 XPApr-14-2022 4:38 PM

Fireteams is basically Left4Dead in an Aliens skin. My friend and I cleared the campaign on Stanford difficulty. Not much to do now aside from bumping the difficulty up and maxing out classes. And a new class arrives about a week before Alien day. No new missions sadly. 

Let's see I've played 

Aliens arcade from Konami 

Alien 3 on NES, SNES, Gameboy, Sega Genesis, Sega Master system, Sega Game gear 

Alien 3 The Gun 

AVP on SNES 

AVP on Gameboy

AVP arcade

Alien Trilogy

Alien Resurrection

Aliens Thanatos Encounter

AVP Extinction 

Predator Concrete Jungle (There are Xenomorph late in the game) 

AVP 2010 

Aliens Infestation 

Aliens Colonial Marines 

AVP Evolution 

Alien Isolation 

Aliens vs Pinball 

Alien Blackout 

Aliens Fireteams Elite 

And some crappy java games as well as Alien Covenant In Utero which doesn't really count. 

That was really off topic...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

Xenotaris

PraetorianMember3266 XPApr-15-2022 6:45 AM

I do like some of the lore fluff in Fireteam its just I wish they would have spent more time developing the story and characters because you can't just cut and paste gorman's marine's personalities to every colonial marine squad out there.

What I am trying to say, not every colonial marine squad/fireteam would be a band of misfits because if that were the case, the United America would have a very hard time maintaining their sector of space especially against their friend and rival, the Three World Empire or their enemies, the Union of Progressive People.

As for alien/predator games I have played, here it is...

Alien 3 (SNES)
Alien Trilogy
Alien Resurrection (PS1)
Alien versus Predator 1999/Classic
Aliens versus Predator 2 {My Favorite}
Aliens versus Predator 2: Primal Hunt {My second Favorite}
Aliens versus Predator Extinction
Predator Concrete Jungle
Alien vs Predator: Requiem (browser game)
Alien vs Predator 2010
Aliens Extermination
Aliens Arcade
Aliens Colonial Marine
Alien Isolation
Predator Hunting Grounds
Aliens Fireteam Elite

Bonus:

The Sims Alien and Predator mods
Predator vs Prey (AVP Morrowind mod)
Star Wars Battleground AVP Mod
Left 4 Dead 2 Aliens mod
Minecraft AVP/Prometheus mods
Starbound AVP mod
Neverwinter Nights ALIENS mod
Rimworld AVP mod
Predator The Lost Tribe (AVP Skyrim Mod)
ALIEN RPG

ALIEN VERSUS PREDATOR UNIVERSE
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