Alien Movie Universe

A Second Viewing: The Sacrifice of a Masterpiece

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.

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-05-2012 8:23 PMUpon watching the movie Prometheus for a second time, I was struck by an overriding new understanding of the film makers needs and most of their objectives in the creation of this new segment of the Alien canon. While I sat there, I noted the frantic pace by which the entire movie was moving; with the characters fulfilling their plot requirements, the dialogue interjecting information, and the objectives being met with each chapter completed. Once the movie was finished, I just shook my head in understanding and of misery... Ridley had no other choice, but to structure this movie in such a way as to fulfill all that he wanted to present to the audience. It was really too much material, but due to constraints of budget and overall audience satisfaction, he had to economize his presentation. This sacrificed both narration and character development and set the movie at a breakneck pace. Do you see this as a worthwhile goal in order to create this movie, or should he have consulted other individuals about the story and rethought it's objectives with later movies in consideration?
31 Responses to A Second Viewing: The Sacrifice of a Masterpiece

Cypher

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-05-2012 8:37 PMI agree with you 100 percent Patch, the pacing was one of my issues with the film, there was no brooding sense of menace throughout like the original Alien had, the music was woefully inadequate for the setting, it was too light and airy and Star Trek-ish, I didn't feel any connection to any of the characters really, yeah Fassy was good as David and Noomi as Shaw but I actually cared about each of the characters on the Nostromo, even Ash, though I was always highly suspicious of him. But yes, it was way too rushed. Needed at least another half hour.
[url=http://www.robocopmovie.net/][img]http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac89/snorkelbottom/NewRoboBanner.jpg[/img][/url] "Is it dead this time?" "I dunno, poke it with this stick and see."

Svanya

PraetorianAdmin4335 XPAug-05-2012 9:09 PMThis was my major problem with the movie as well, it REALLY needed at least 45 min more to just give the viewer time to digest what was going on.

Ghost Solitare

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-05-2012 9:17 PMChiming in on what Svanya said. I also agree, when I visit a new city, or take a vacation I try to see everything possible. Get a feeling for the place, it's people, the vibe. In Prometheus, I wanted to see what life was like for people living at the end of this century. Show me a little more about this human race that's expanded by the millions to colonies throughout the stars. It didn't feel like there was a reason for the supporting cast other than driving the story along and adding to the body count.

Engineering

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-05-2012 9:48 PMNo problem with the pacing for me. I would have loved more but I realize that the movie industry is not about pleasing the small number of film goers who enjoy the things I enjoy. Hell, I realize it's not about pleasing anyone. It's about money. Regardless of that fact I had no problem with the pacing. I agree that RS had to do certain things making this film. He had a lot he had to take care of. He had to make a film he was proud of and thought would honor the franchise. He had to make a film that would somewhat appease the built in audience the franchise comes with. He had to please a new, younger audience which may or may not be very familiar-if at all-with the past films. He had to please the studio. All this while trying to lay down a foundation where these ideas can be explored in a franchise. Personally, I think he did a magnificent job regardless of all this let alone in light of it all.
[IMG]http://i1161.photobucket.com/albums/q507/Engineering211/sig2.jpg[/IMG]

shambs

OvomorphMember40 XPAug-05-2012 10:03 PMI totally agree with breaking the monotony of the franchise but I think that Scott should ask someone else to rewrite the script. Certainly needed something new and provocative but with a better script would have been any better. On the other hand, why the classification R? Why Ridley says that the goal is to scare the living ****? I honestly would have preferred a PG-13, with more money and a longer and epic result. It would be interesting to see deeper into the characters of Engineers, because these almost seem cold and lifeless robots. David has more life to them LOL. If the sequel is going to be short so I hope it's a very dark and scary movie. If FOX can not do that then I prefer something more larger and in a big scale. Sorry but it's my honest opinion. regards

CULT

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 1:23 AMExcellent observation. I can't believe I still read posts about this movie.

Sky

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 1:27 AMPace was serious issue. Even cam movies or conspiracy movies are planned better than prometheus. Look at battleship, chronicle, hunger games, etc. Hell even twilights build up was good lol. I am only waiting for the graphics, I am sure RS and CGI team did good job over there. That said, imagine the prologue to be revealed inside the temple when fifield and shaw fights and then look at the wall drawing and signs for that story, after the observe hollogram sequence. That part could have been better as it worked out for the AVP. It also gives the temple the feel that we were searching for. In current movie the temple looks more like some greek temple where people wander during their holidays. No dark feel, no fear for creature nothing at all. Another thing is that many parts were arranged in wrong order, like shaw's dream and introduction of crew once they reached to prometheus. I mean seriously? you are bringing them together at one place after taking them out of cryosleep where all the crew was there already? That is the problem with writing from people who make TV series and B grade movies.
Uncertainty is the only certainty there is, and knowing how to live with insecurity is the only security.

spacejock

OvomorphMember1 XPAug-06-2012 1:34 AM@Shambhala, I think the scenes that made it R movie add a lot to it, and are amazing scenes that did freak me out. Ive seen it 5 times, and came to a coclusion that the one and only thing missing is the impact of Giger's designs on the walls in the pyramid. He did not work on these, and it shows. But yea hes too old to work on it I guess..

Custodian

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 2:18 AMthere was a Christmas tree ... what more do you people need?
2013 sci-fi horror novels 'Custodian' and 'Tandem' available from Amazon, B&N, iTunes etc...

zzplural

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 4:07 AM@Sky: [i]"I mean seriously? you are bringing them together at one place after taking them out of cryosleep where all the crew was there already? That is the problem with writing from people who make TV series and B grade movies." [/i] What are you suggesting? That Vickers should have done her pep talk while they were puking up on the edge of their cryo tubes?
The most terrifying fact about the universe is not that it is hostile but that it is indifferent

chthon

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 5:55 AMBack story done in the style of 'Aliens' is passe. Times have moved on. Ridley used the internet for the 'backstory' pf Shaw and Weyland. Also, some of the back story is in the dream-voyeuring David does.

Crabfart

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 5:24 AMYes should of rethought it - it did seem rushed and muddled and with only 2 writers in the chain it felt like ridley and lindelof had such status that no one challenged them before it went to production :(. But heres hoping there was an overall plan hiding in the background ! Still cant bring myself to watch it for a 2nd time yet but I will - hopfully with a re-cut :D !

BigDave

DeaconMember10416 XPAug-06-2012 6:56 AMThats spot on with my thoughts. The movie for me had these flaws that held it back from being a Masterpeice. 1) Time restraints/Budget The movies scope and story needed a longer run time to cover it, i felt the movie needed about 3 hours or indeed a two part 1hr45 mins. 2) Lindelof There is some elements of his style of writing that has left its mark on the movie and i mean some plot holes. The Ambiguity was fine, just mainly use of Characters and Characters performing out of character. 3) Butchered at the Edit Room. The movie seems to not flow well, it just looked like something was missing in a number of scenes that never added up. It was as if someone just went and cut bits and pieces out of scenes. And low and behold that was the case, at least 20 mins was cut from the movie and also their was some alternative scenes that i feel would have made the movie better. These inc... 1) The Longer and more Alien Looking Fifield Attack/Mutation. 2) The full Sacrificial Engineer scene with dialog and Elders. 3) The full David and Engineer scene, two way dialog. 4) The full Engineer and Shaw attack scene. It also could appear that there may have been alternative hanger scene and also Engineer attack on Ford Scene. Add those things back and i think the movie would look better, but i understand why some was left out of the movie.... Save Elders for Prometheus 2, Fifield looked to Alien in DNA, Shaw Attack scene made Engineer look not as awe inspiring. But surely the Dialog between David and Engineer should been kept, unless again it revealed more information that they want to keep for Prometheus 2. The Franchise has a lot of potential mind.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

DeaconMember10416 XPAug-06-2012 7:04 AM@spacejock Apparently Ridley had to alter and cut some scenes out and down in order to get the movie to under 18s Some of the attack scenes came across lame and does not even touch the AVP movies as far as gruesomeness. I dont think Ridley would have intended that and proclaimed the movie will scare you. So i do think some scenes had been changed, a prime example of that is Ford, the actress had said she meets a horrific death. We also see in some of the behind scenes videos they render Fords Head. Why bother CGI Ford just so she gets pushed across the floor... really would that kill her? Also note that prior to the push Ford was having a fit. I therefore think there was another scene where something much more graphic happened to Ford, and maybe something far worse than David getting his head torn off.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

aurorian

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 10:24 AM.

BigDave

DeaconMember10416 XPAug-06-2012 11:13 AMI dont know..... some of the trailers showed her to be shaking as if she was having convulsions and they did do a CGI of her head..... And look at how she died, i mean being pushed across the room, i doubt would killed her. I have no proof other than there was a CGI head shot and she looked to be having a fit. We dont know why that was, maybe the Engineer used mind control to make her head explode or maybe she had been infected we just dont know. There is also a interview with the Special Effects out there where they said one seen we see someones head explode (could that be the Engineer head they found/) and another where someones head is smashed in pieces on the floor (Fifield did smash one guys head in but hardly that gory).

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Custodian

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 11:20 AMSky, the 'bringing them together' on site like that, without anyone seeming to know what side they're shooting for, is a classic intelligence or covert operation. I suspect very very few people at Weyland were in the NEED TO KNOW loop for the Prometheus mission ... I also suspect Shaw/Holloway were working for Yutani as counter-intel assets. LOL
2013 sci-fi horror novels 'Custodian' and 'Tandem' available from Amazon, B&N, iTunes etc...

.

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 3:33 PM@aurorian Not a problem, I anticipate and like the broad strokes our members lay out for us to enjoy and ponder. Still need that link of Ford.... AAAHHHHH!!!!

.

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 11:51 AM@BigDave do you have a url of the trailer of Ford? I would love to view that.... please!!! Thanks for posting... In fact thank you everyone for posting your views on this thread. I always appreciate the time you take to write down your thoughts/ideas/theories.

aurorian

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 12:30 PM.

Sky

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 12:37 PM@ZZplural [quote]What are you suggesting? That Vickers should have done her pep talk while they were puking up on the edge of their cryo tubes?[/quote] ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Do you get lecture from your superior about company before the interview or on your field trip's day 1? It's like you are not even introduced to your roommates in dorm room after you wake up and brush the teeth but when some rector asks you to talk. Very poor arrangement. Hope you get the point. Look at AVP, they placed the scene in correct order. You don't take people directly onto the ship without telling them about mission or keeping them with each other before boarding onto ship. Not even national emergency missions work like that. That's fatal error. Crew members are notified and introduced to each other before they are taken to field. @Freeplanet [quote]the 'bringing them together' on site like that, without anyone seeming to know what side they're shooting for, is a classic intelligence or covert operation.[/quote] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I don't think so. Not even military operations work like that. Announcing prometheus mission to investors and declaring the formal agenda on website and then acting as if it's covert operation doesn't make any sense.
Uncertainty is the only certainty there is, and knowing how to live with insecurity is the only security.

Custodian

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 12:46 PMSky, of course you're right if Weyland ANNOUNCED the Prometheus Project as a VOYAGE TO MEET OUR MAKERS. Is that the timeline?
2013 sci-fi horror novels 'Custodian' and 'Tandem' available from Amazon, B&N, iTunes etc...

synthetic_69

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 1:08 PMLast night I went to see "Prometheus" for the sixth time. The art design and cinematography are stunning. For the most part the pacing is just fine. The third quarter of the film certainly has some issues and then it picks back up in the fourth quarter. Fassbender is brilliant. While Rapace's performance is not as stellar as that of Fassbender she commits herself to the role. I don't care what the haters say: I friggin' love Sean Harris' performance as Fifield. Was the film perfect? Hell no but this is the best big budget sci-fi movie that has been made in years. I'm fine with the unanswered mysteries and riddles in the film and I would LOVE to see where it is that Shaw and David go in the next film. I'll say this: last night was the first time that I saw the film in 2D and I was impressed with how well the film visually holds up in 2D. That is absolutely not the case with "Avatar" and to me that fact only further supports Scott's decision to rely more heavily on physical sets and scenery than on CGI. I do wish that this film had been closer to perfect but the parts of it that Scott got right are almost seamless in their content and execution and for that helps to offset the issues contained in the third quarter of the film. There is so much to appreciate and respect about this film. I'm less frustrated by the film's flaws than I am by the knitpicking critiques that some give the film. "Prometheus" has built upon the "Alien" films that came before it, added new substance to the universe those films inhabit and presented new pathways for future 'Alien" related films to travel. I truly hope that Scott is at the helm of the next film in the franchise. He was my biggest concern going into my first viewing of "Prometheus" and after 6 viewings of the film I'm geeked out at the idea that Scott will direct the next "Alien" related film.

Sky

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 1:24 PM@freeplanet [quote]Sky, of course you're right if Weyland ANNOUNCED the Prometheus Project as a VOYAGE TO MEET OUR MAKERS.Is that the timeline?[/quote] Do you think any ship with name prometheus takes off from earth and other government and business people are not noticing it? Weyland investors not knowing about it? We are talking about spaceship here, not subway train. Ofcourse people around the world will know about it. This is no covert operation picnic. lol
Uncertainty is the only certainty there is, and knowing how to live with insecurity is the only security.

David 1

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 5:01 PMI totally agree Patch.
[b]Ask nothing from no one. Demand nothing from no one. Expect nothing from no one.[/b]

spacejock

OvomorphMember1 XPAug-06-2012 5:13 PMHonestly, I only saw parts of the first AVP movie, and the only thing that scared me to death was the realization that they're turning the franchise into a bull**** for ****tards. no offense, just being honest. There are are almost subtle visual and sonic elements of Ridley that really make it freaky. Unfortunate that it only comes through to a fraction of fans.

sukkal

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-06-2012 7:11 PM A recut of this film with certain gratuitous zombie action in the garage removed and all of the deleted stuff (or at least MOST of it) added back in could make this a MUCH MUCH better film. Pray for [url=http://www.prometheus-movie.com/community/forums/topic/9011]THE RESTORATION[/url] and that it will be released again on large screens and not just on DVD/Blu-Ray.

Custodian

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-07-2012 3:13 AM@Sukkal, not convinced ANY 'restoration' cut is to be released. Only Extras or Menu items on Home format. @Sky, of course a COVERT OPERATION (which I still believe this was) such as PROMETHEUS wouldn't begin with all the publicity, pomp and cir***stance of an Earth-based launch. Weyland has off-world colonies at this point, right? Orbiting space factories, right?
2013 sci-fi horror novels 'Custodian' and 'Tandem' available from Amazon, B&N, iTunes etc...

.

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-07-2012 10:49 AMI feel this mission was not so much a covert operations, but a private venture.

protheos

OvomorphMember0 XPAug-07-2012 11:14 AMI have to agree that both the pacing and character development held the movie back a bit from what it could've been. The Charlie character was just all wrong. Came across as a ****y and simplistic jerk. And with the exception of Shaw and David (and Weyland), none of the characters act as if there's anything particularly important at stake in 'finding their creators'. That's a major storytelling problem. The film can't expect the audience to embrace the importance of its premise and the unfolding of that premise if its own characters are so cavalier about what's at stake. The theatrical film would've been enhanced if it had incorporated the 2023 TED talk right after the sacrificial opening scene. It would've helped fill out Weyland's character and given far more depth to the importance and motives of the mission (either good or ill) than relying on too many half baked characters who don't give the audience any reason for caring about them or their mission. To be clear, on balance, I liked the film. It asked some good questions, effectively showed how questions of origin exercise great power over what we do and how we live today, and left a variety of tantalizaing and plausible lines of thought that could be pursued in upcoming films. But sometimes, a film that could've been great but was just good is more frustrating than a bad flick that never had a chance to be any different.
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