Forum Topic
ukalien
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 5:34 PMI would like to hear more talk on why the planet LV-462 looks so much different in alien compared to prometheus? Im sure its safe to say it IS the same planet from alien because of the crashed ship. Maybe the dust cloud we see in the trailer has something to do with the change in atmosphere.. would be cool to hear more
78 Replies
Dropyourlinen
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 6:34 PMIt's Zeta Reticuli! It say's so on the Weyland Yutaini website?? (I'm pretty sure it does)?
Not_my_intention
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 6:48 PMwhy does everyone say that Cameron's ideas are not cannon? now i can understand not liking it (i mean i love it but still) but that does not make it not cannon. like i said, there are more relations to aliens then there is alien. and if aliens is not cannon..... then why add the D on the end of weyland?????
LV426JGFPM
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 6:50 PMJust because Cameron created the queen still doesn't mean it couldn't have existed in Alien... Just because you never see a queen in Alien doesn't mean there never was one.
Sigismundo
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 6:51 PM[quote][i]why does everyone say that Cameron's ideas are not cannon? now i can understand not liking it (i mean i love it but still) but that does not make it not cannon. like i said, there are more relations to aliens then there is alien. and if aliens is not cannon..... then why add the D on the end of weyland?????[/i][/quote]
[quote][i]Just because Cameron created the queen still doesn't mean it couldn't have existed in Alien... Just because you never see a queen in Alien doesn't mean there never was one.[/i][/quote]
Ridley Scott has been quoted as saying he enjoyed Aliens, but that does not make Cameron's ideas canon to Alien/Prometheus.
You can't pick and choose. If Aliens is canon 'just because', then 3/Resurrection/AvPI&II would then be too.
Judging by the direction Prometheus is taking, the Queen is definitely not canon because all that does is strip the Xenomorphs down to nothing but alien cockroaches.
Not_my_intention
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:02 PM@Sigismundo
please i don't want to get in this again, go read the big discussion on the alien discussions page called "alien vs aliens" should be about half way down. and i think that 3 is cannon, i dont think resurrection is because it changed it to almost a dark comedy, and if it is cannon it really doesn't matter anyway, but AvP is 100% not cannon, they are based on the comic books, not the actual alien and predator movies, that makes them there own separate cannon. and there is nothing in Prometheus that says there cant be a queen. in fact it makes the possibility for a queen even more open, because yeah they wont explore that, but it is about mutation and the miss use of bio tech correct? with that the possibility is open for anything including a queen forming in the mix. and why do people hate the bug idea so much????? IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE BUG LIKE IN THE FIRST MOVIE!!!!!!!!! and what do you think is the most successful species on the planet is???? you can bet your ass its not us!!!!! just go crack open a termite hill and watch how effective they are.
T-Minus-Five
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:03 PMI don't think it's LV-426.
In Zeta-Reticuli and in Alien, there are other planets that are seen in the space shots.
Also - if Prometheus ends with the Derelict (Bone-ship) set up for Alien - then there won't be the possibility for a Prometheus sequel - and that would be true disaster.
So then, why is this movie about the Space Jockey and why is the ship here? Why not just create another story and be done with it? BECAUSE Ridley Scott said he always wanted to go back and tell the SJ story. That is what Prometheus is about.
It does not matter to me if it or any sequels tie directly into Alien. I'm excited about the 'new series' in any case...
TM5
LV426JGFPM
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:04 PMWell who is to say that the "engineers" didn't foresee the byproduct of creating a weapon that evolved. They may have intended to create the xenomorph to do its planet "cleaning" but maybe their weapon wanted to continue on its own. The Space Jockey race may be more advanced than the humans, but that certainly does not make them perfect.
Not_my_intention
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:08 PM@T-Minus-Five
yeah but he wanted to explain the story of the space jockey in alien, and if its not the same jockey, THEN WHATS THE POINT?
P.S. when i use CAPS thats not me yelling, its me exaggerating so dont worry, i am not fighting with anybody when i do that lol :D
Not_my_intention
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:10 PM@LV426JGFPM
i like the way you think :) anything is possible.
Sigismundo
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:10 PM@invaderzim42
My point is unless Ridley Scott comes out and accepts any of the sequels as canon, it is safe to say none are. If he ties himself down to events in Aliens, he limits the universe he created.
Alien was small yet grand at the same time, because it had so much mystery with no answers. I seriously down Scott/Lindelof would limit themselves to something as simplistic as a queen laying eggs.
In multiple interviews we've heard the same thing: "same universe as Alien." It would be just as easy to say "same universe as in the Alien series" or "same universe as Alien and Aliens", but he never has.
T-Minus-Five
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:15 PMOkay, fine. So he tells the story of the space jockey in Alien and then hits a dead end because then there will be no where else to take it. I think it may be in a sequel - possibly. And of course over all of these years he - Ridley Scott - could have changed his mind. Like he did with regards to doing a 'direct' prequel to Alien.
But in any case - like I said - I think no matter what, we'll all be very very pleased with this movie - whatever happens. Well, not if those rock piles on the planet wind up becoming the alien that attacks them - LOL! Now THAT would be horrible * not yelling, just exaggerating * LOL
TM5
Sigismundo
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:17 PM[quote][i]yeah but he wanted to explain the story of the space jockey in alien, and if its not the same jockey, THEN WHATS THE POINT?[/i][/quote]
@invaderzim42
The point is by telling a separate story in the same universe about the how/why/when/where/etc. of the space jockeys, fans of Alien will be able to solve pieces of the puzzle the SJ in Alien left behind.
At the same time, by being a separate story, it is not alienating movie goers who have not seen Alien, thus, as another member pointed out, laying the carpet for sequels.
Look at it from a business perspective: say Prometheus makes a HUGE profit - if Ridley actually ended with the derelict crashing on lv 426 and/or allowed the sequels to be canon, then he just screws and limits himself with the sequels that the studio would want because there is already an established timeline/mythology.
Not_my_intention
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:19 PM@Sigismundo
i cant stress how much it bothers me when people bring this up, for the last time, i am going to say this. here i go. "[b]Scott is not the almighty god of the alien universe! he has just as much a right to decide what is cannon as my dog does! he simply directed the first movie, he did not write it and he did not write Prometheus! he is a good director but does not decide whats what!!![/b]" and done. do you see what i mean? giving scott the right to change the universe at will, is like giving the camera guy of a wedding the right to decide if they get a divorce or not. it makes NO sense. if there was one guy who did have the right, it would be dan o'bannon and he is dead (god rest his soul) and also, he co wrote aliens so i dont think he would object.
T-Minus-Five
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:23 PMScott did not do the writing, but he certainly did say to the writers where he wanted this story to go...
And also - this is a movie - it's not real life. It can't be compared to a 'divorce'.
artyoh
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:23 PMThey don't [i]need[/i] to tie it up into a neat little bow, where someone or something in this movie ends up being the dead SJ in "Alien." Frankly, I think it would be a bit too predictably contrived if they did. Why would Ridley Scott resort to stereotype, in revisiting one of his most beloved properties? I dunno, I'm just not seeing it.
Sigismundo
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:25 PM@invaderzim42
With all due respect - do you understand how much impact and influence a director has on a film? Alien is [i]his[/i] film. Any film is the directors film - the only entity to have a say over a film's director is the studio.
Not_my_intention
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:28 PM@Sigismundo
finally a good explanation for why it wouldn't be on lv426, and no i somewhat respect that opinion, but i still dont think that is the case. i dont think anybody would go to such a length to make something just as cannon as its not. it just doesn't work for me. if it is true, and its pulled of awesomely, then that's awesome i bet it would be great, but i just don't see it happening :(
P.S. sorry that these responses are kind of strange, every time i respond by the time i am done you already have a new comment, so you need to try and figure out what response goes to what comment lol sorry :D
T-Minus-Five
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:31 PMFrom this page: [url=http://collider.com/ridley-scott-damon-lindelof-michael-fassbender-prometheus-interview/153243/]Click me...[/url]
RIDLEY SCOTT: It’s easier to carry it out, but it’s still as difficult to write something. In fact, it’s getting more difficult because there are almost too many movies being made.
DAMON LINDELOF: Yeah, and I think that it would have been really difficult to do a straight-up Alien sequel or Alien prequel because you’re beholden to so many of the things that came before it. To be able to shed that stuff [made it easier]. [size=200][size=200]This was Ridley’s idea[/size][/size]. From the screenwriting standpoint, for me, it was really just all about getting a clear sense of what was the movie [size=200]that he wanted to make[/size]. [size=200]It’s Ridley Scott. The movie is his vision[/size], so I did my best to channel it. We had almost no conversations about any other movies, other then this one, which might have been hubris or it might have been freeing, but it felt good, maybe just because we were drunk.
TM5
ps - and of course - they could be lying!
Not_my_intention
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:33 PM@Sigismundo yes i do know how much influence a director has, i hope to be one some day actually, but i still don't think that gives him any right. the producer and the writer are asking for a piece of art, and hire an artist to make it for them. that does not give the artist the right to do what he wishes with it. and true, Scott does have some control over the series, but if he seriously has the control to do whatever he wants with the cannon then that's just bull, end of story.
T-Minus-Five
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:36 PMHence the reason why this isn't an 'Alien' movie. It's the story about the Space Jockey, which has no canon - until Prometheus comes out.
I'm going to another post - hehehe
TM5
Not_my_intention
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:37 PMSTOP!!!!!!!!!!! EVERYONE STOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! change the subject, i really don't want to get into this again. if you think its lv426 then talk theory of why its different, if you don't think its lv426 then......... this is not the topic for you lol :D
artyoh
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:42 PMLast post on this topic.........If what Lindelof said in that interview is true, then Scott was essentially given carte blanche as to where the "franchise" goes from here. He may well have insisted on that before agreeing to helm the project.
T-Minus-Five
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:43 PMOkay. Hehe, I was wondering how long this was going to go on.
If it IS LV-426 then I think that perhaps over the years between Prometheus and Alien that the planet just goes through a series of changes. Perhaps volcanic in nature and all of those rock piles start to grow or get debris build up on them and then at night when it's cold or whatever it solidifies. I don't know.
If it's not LV-426 - oh, yeah. I can't say. LOL
Sigismundo
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:47 PM@invaderzim42
I apologize. I spend most of my time on another film/tv message board that is basically full of perverts and nitwits, so it's nice to have a discussion with people who know what the heck they're talking about!
@T-Minus-Five
I have thought, (if it [i]is[/i] LV-426), an 'easy way out' of the planets changes would be some sort of nuclear devastation. Though I hope that does not happen. At. All. Too easy/obvious/corny.
Sigismundo
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:52 PM@T-Minus-Five
Also, thanks for that link. I had not read that interview.
Not_my_intention
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 7:53 PM@Sigismundo
thats ok lol i understand completely, if you still want to we can keep going at it on the other forum i mentioned, but not here, let this keep its virginity of a big argument (argument sounds like i mean fighting and discussion sounds too nice so idk what word to use lol)
serratedproboscis
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 8:08 PMLike T-minus-5 said, there are other planets in the original Alien shots. That being said. We see the SJ ship getting nailed by prometheus (or at least blowing up right on it/next to it) and we see it crash. We do NOT see it getting damaged. The damned thing might just get up and fly away to LV-426. As in maybe the pilot was injured in the prometheus crash, but came too, injured, and managed to fly a bit away only to lose it later. Could happen.
But if there are multiple temples/egg silos, there could be multiple ships. We see the ground open up under the characters, yet we can't place the timing of it. Who's to say the entire region isn't littered with underground stations?
Sigismundo
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 8:17 PM@serratedproboscis
Good thoughts.
A lot of ideas about the SJ in Prometheus and Alien are limited because people assume/want them to the be same being.
If we approach the films with the idea that the Jockey is one in a number of its own species and not a singular entity, then there's no reason for the Prometheus Jockey to inevitably be the one who crashes on LV-426.
zzodr
MemberOvomorphMar-23-2012 8:41 PMBTW folks. it's "canon" ...not the thing that fires projectiles. mmmkay?
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