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MAKE ALIEN GREAT AGAIN!

MAKE ALIEN GREAT AGAIN!

4 Upvotes152 RepliesUpvoteAdd A Reply
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BigDave

Jul-05-2020 6:37 AM

With the FRANCHISE being in a Pickle at the Moment, with the Prequels being in Cyro-sleep... maybe for 57 Years ;)

The ALIEN Franchise is still Regarded as a Great Franchise that still makes MONEY in other Mediums/Merchandise.

I think that a VAST Majority see ALIEN as a Great Movie

It Spawned a Sequel that i think a LOT of Fans still Enjoy and Respect, and ONE that made the IMAGE of the ALIEN become more Mainstream.

Since that GOLDEN ERA for the Franchise, things got a lot more Divisive and Disappointing for the Fanbase.

I dont think we have had a GOOD Movie since 1986 we have seen some Potential with what Followed, but then also Flaws.

Can the ALIEN Franchise be made GREAT AGAIN?

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

152 Responses to MAKE ALIEN GREAT AGAIN!

BigDave

Jul-20-2020 3:55 AM

I think its Important to remember we are talking about SCI-FI and so your allowed some Creativity and to Curve the Lines of what is Science and what is Fiction/Fantasy ;)

I think the Franchise is already Confined to a BOX, which Prometheus had opened up but with Alien Covenant we have ONLY explored a CLOSE part of Space to Earth.

I think there is MASSIVE SCOPE to explore NEW Worlds, which our Imaginations can run Wild....

If we ever got a Sequel to Alien Covenant then MAYBE it would take us to Oriage-6 which would BE the Furthest we have Traveled in  the Franchise.  As it would seem that Oriage-6 would be about 350LY away.  But there is the Potential to go to other worlds Located 500, 700, 1000 or even 1500LY away within the Franchise.. especially the LATTER we go in the Time-Line

I think for some it may seem Interesting to bring the Beast or Engineers home to Earth.... but we have to bare in MIND this would Conflict the Franchise.... UNLESS it was revealed that Alien 3 and Alien R were merely Dreams!

However....... maybe you could introduce them to our Solar System another way?

I think it was GAVIN who proposed a PLOT about Discovering a Juggernaught at the BOTTOM of the Ocean.

In Light of Alien Covenant then i find it unlikely we would have EGGS on such a Ship that has been at the Bottom of the Sea for Thousands of Years... but as far as BLACK GOO!  well that could be Explored.

What happens when the Cargo of Black Goo becomes Disturbed or Unleashed?

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

Jul-20-2020 4:24 AM

But looking at the Comments on this TOPIC i think i can conclude a few things..

*It seems that more seem to be Interested in SOME of the things that Prometheus had Opened Up.  The Engineers being a Particular interest.

*It seems to be a Pretty Mixed Bag when it comes down to the Themes of Prometheus in context to Creation/Sub Creation.

*It seems to be a Pretty Mixed Bag when it comes down to the Emphasis on A.I and David... mostly the Xeno Creator Plot struck a Nerve with many.

*Seems that only a SMALL Proportion think we have to have Movies about the Xenomorphs.

*Exploration of New Worlds/Threats seems to be what is more appealing.

And so its as i said before on this TOPIC.... would the Fans accept a ALIEN Movie which does-not have the Xenomorph?

Prometheus never had the Xenomorph but maybe it needed something similar, Alien Covenant never really needed a Xenomorph.

so LETS go BACK and Change/Assume either or BOTH of these TWO things.

*Planet 4 was Located MUCH further away.

*David does-not go to Planet 4

Then if we go to the COVENANT MISSION and say that goes ahead BUT they DONT suffer any Malfunctions.

So the Covenant Ship and its Crew/Colonist make it to Origae-6 intact.

So imagine if Alien Covenant never happened as it did but instead we have it be about the Covenant Ship reaching ORIGAE-6!

Imagine as they Set Down on the Surface with NO threat and all seems FINE... they begin to BRING down Many parts of the Covenant.   They then go off to another Location thats FAR from any Lake... well where they had decided to SET UP their Base.

They Discover in what seems to be a Long Dead Jungle or Burred under Sand some remnants of a Ancient City, and then some Dead Humanoid Figures maybe TALLER than Humans.

They then come to a Water Source (if near Jungle) and by this we have the NEOMORPH SPORES... and the Neomorph is Introduced this WAY!

Or if the Ancient Ruins are discovered mostly Buried in Sand then they could uncover some Open Urns but then a CLOSED ONE... so they take that back to Base Camp thinking its some kind of Ancient Jar with NO threat... and we get a Outbreak/Infection this way.

Which ever route be it the Neomorph or some other Horror we could SHOW them go and Procreate via a Egg Morph... from these come some NEW kind of Face Hugger.

which Capture Hosts and Implant a Embryo (these Face Huggers do-not die after doing this and can infect Multiple Hosts)  then you have Chest Busters to give us another Monster that is a little Different to what had transpired already on Origae-6.

Then would SUCH a Movie (Provided Characters are Good) would this been seen as a ALIEN Movie?

You would make the Connection via the Weyland-Yutani Company Ship, and the Ancient Ruins and Urns would link to the Engineers.

Where we would be lead to that THIS was a World that had suffered a Bombardment of Black Goo at some point THOUSANDS of Years ago.

The Reason i mention this is that i feel the Neomorph was connected to the Xenomorph, we could see some Connection and so you DONT have to have Monsters that are a CARBON Copy as long as they either have something we can make a Connection to the Black Goo/Deacon/Xeno either Aesthetically or via its Life-Cycle/Procreation.

And while we did get AC.....  i think we CANT rule out that the Engineers had USED their Black Goo on some Worlds and wonder what HORRORS had came from this... because what Alien Covenant had shown was that the Neomorph was the Outcome on that World...   and i think its UNLIKELY the Engineers had NOT been and TESTED the Bio-Weapon on a World before.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

hox

Jul-20-2020 9:24 AM

"Exploration of New Worlds/Threats seems to be what is more appealing.

Prometheus never had the Xenomorph but maybe it needed something similar, Alien Covenant never really needed a Xenomorph."

Very very true.

I don't think we need to undo what AC gave us. There's plenty of scope to take the story off at a complete tangent.

I went to an oyster bar in Whitstable yesterday. I was looking at some slimy wet oyster innards on my plate thinking how much they looked like the upturned face hugger (I'm sure the prop had a few when Bishop was tampering). But also the shell of the oyster... knobbly, hard, organic, asymmetric... very creepy and alien. An oyster shell with fingers would make for a great new variant on a face hugger.

MonsterZero

Jul-20-2020 5:39 PM

BigDave wrote: "Emphasis on A.I and David"

I think of David as a walking, talking version of Weyland Corp. He is a product of inbreeding. ..Walter/Bishop/Call on the other hand, are products of two different parents, Weyland and Yutani... Maybe? 

 



The Engineer's armored glove reached for him. The shield surrounding David 'crackled' with energy.  “Ahh...temper, temper”, David mouthed to the Engineer; sound waves not traveling outside his shield.  The heavily armored Engineer took a step back. David then stopped lightwaves from penetrating his shield.

SuperAlien

Jul-20-2020 9:43 PM

"An oyster shell with fingers would make for a great new variant on a face hugger."

interesting. I imagine David had a similar revelation during his experiments on Planet 4.

"He survived, he’s now in Disneyland in Orlando, and no way am I going back there. How did he end up in Disneyland? I saw him in Disneyland, Jesus Christ!"

Leto

Jul-21-2020 2:21 AM

It was. And it was really cool!

BigDave

Jul-21-2020 3:30 AM

Leto that Certainly was Interesting a lot of Davids Notes and Life he found does indicate he had been using the Black Goo to Extract and Combine Various Traits from Various Organisms to achieve his Masterpiece.

I think the Wonder of going to NEW Worlds is to see how Varied the Environments and Life-Forms are, even regarding the Native Species...... 

A Newly Discovered World can be VERY Interesting.... but then VERY Horrific after the Pathogen is Unleashed.

I think the ALIEN Franchise had the Scope to NOT be restrained to Ripley and Xenomorphs, which i know is what the Franchise is Recognized for..

But there are other Elements at play.... Weyland-Yutani company History, Rivalry and WHAT else they do apart from Chase after Xenomorphs..   The Colonial Marines as ALIENS was not their First Bug Hunt and maybe NOT their First.   Then you have the Engineers and by Virtue of their Plot this OPENS up many Worlds, many Species which dont have to be Intelligent Humanoids....

These could all be Interesting before we even add the Pathogen or A.I Elements.

I think with ALIEN what it should symbolize is the Humanity Journey to the Depths of Space for whatever reasons that may be.. Colonization, Resources etc or purely Scientific Exploration..... then its going to ALIEN Worlds and Encountering a Threat... 

But for some you cant STEER from the Xenomorph.. well certainly have to have something Connected and so within context to the ALIEN Franchise i think you can introduce a ALIEN threat that is Connected either by being linked to the Experiments with the Black Goo/Result of the Pathogen or even Explore something that had STARTED all those Experiments.

I think you can make new Adventures in the ALIEN Franchise it would be just getting the Mainstream to look Beyond that a ALIEN Movie does not have to be about the Xenomorph on LV-426.

But i do think you can go back to the Xenomorph maybe for 1-2 more rounds if its done right and a bit different.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

SuperAlien

Jul-21-2020 4:12 AM

Cool. Where did you get that from,Leto?

It looks like cabbage when it's folded. 

We should have a museum dedicated to Alien, safe haven for all those brilliant props, sets and drawings. 

Ridley Scott is right, this franchise has the potential to be as big as Star Wars, the only thing that was missing was the kid friendly part, but now, in Disneyland, they could fix that too.

"He survived, he’s now in Disneyland in Orlando, and no way am I going back there. How did he end up in Disneyland? I saw him in Disneyland, Jesus Christ!"

dk

Jul-22-2020 1:22 AM

SuperAlien Kid friendly is different from when I was a kid. Things that pass as kid friendly now were considered adult material when I was a kid in the 70s. 

I have seen a few clips from Star Wars shows depicting Storm Troopers  heads on stakes and while interesting, this would have been a no no back then for kids.

Maybe some have an antiquated notion of what is kid friendly these days and not enough credit is given to younger people.

The pics Leto posted may have likely caused kids to be afraid 30 plus years ago, but might engage interest and fascination now with that demographic.

 

SuperAlien

Jul-22-2020 3:27 AM

dk, kids are always curious and easily corrupted by many horrible things. The problem is nobody watch over them anymore, so I believe a pre-teen kid nowadays has seen many more monsters than his parents.

A SuperAlien chestbursting from the Superman himself would attract more kids (parents and grandparents included) into the theaters than a Deacon chestbursting from an Engineer. Who could feel for an Engineer, even knowing he was the last of the Engineers? But you did like Superman when you were a kid, didn't you?

Now, that's what I call kid friendly.

"He survived, he’s now in Disneyland in Orlando, and no way am I going back there. How did he end up in Disneyland? I saw him in Disneyland, Jesus Christ!"

BigDave

Jul-22-2020 4:41 AM

A Superman Alien .... nah i think the HULK-MORPH would be better ;)

Regarding the kids, well on one hand what may have Scared kids in the 60's/70's and 80's would not have the same Effect on kids from the 2000's on-wards... as far as Aesthetics...  they become more accustomed to Horrific Forms and Blood.  Due to the ease of Access and Detail in Games and Comics compared to back 30+ years ago.

I tend to see that the Newer Generation do-not really go for Gore Horror much, its more the Possessed, Zombie kind of Horror stuff nowadays and also they seem to be more into Action, Explosions and Big Epic Crash/Destruction Scenes.  Sometimes maybe the Attention Span seems LESS for those Born from the 90's and i dont mean everyone just seems to more a Higher % will kinda Fall Asleep without ACTION...

I only know 2 People born from the 90's who have seen the ALIEN Movies... one is now 23 the other 21 and they ONLY like ALIENS, AVP and One likes Resurrection but they dont like the others lol  They are BIG Fans of Dead Pool, Amazing Spiderman and New Spidermen, the X-Men Movies etc etc.

Mind you as a kid i was not really Scared of any Movies not that i can ever Recall..... but a FEW Disturbed me.... such as The Thing and its only the Dog Town Scene. Oh and the Dog from The Fly 2 so its more a case of having Sympathy for the Dogs ha ha ha!

With people Dying in Movies most of the Time it dont bother us.... lol....  Maybe i am bit too much like my NAMESAKE!

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

Jul-22-2020 4:59 AM

To get to a more Serious aspect.....   then indeed the ALIEN Franchise in Light of Prometheus could open up us to MANY Worlds, MANY Races and NEW Horrors... and from the Perspective of DISNEY i think thats something they should Concentrate on and it gives them more they can do with a Franchise.... but they could EXPLOIT this into a Gung Ho! Action Multiple Alien Species Fight Fest!

The Franchise also could be explored in SPIN-OFFS!

The Weyland-Yutani company has more to it than just wanting to OBTAIN a Xenomorph... unless we look DEEPER into WHY they would be so Obsessed.

The Colonial Marines have been on other BUG HUNTS... what quite that means, it may not be other Hostile Alien Threats but it could be...  Also by Virtue of them having some time out with the Arcturian Poontang could indicate that Mankind had encountered Alien Species after the events of ALIEN but NOT quite anything like the Xenomorph for the most part.

The Themes of Creation/Sub-Creation and Rebellion  may not appeal to most though.... but i think the A.I arc is interesting Especially when we PONDER about the AUTONS

But i think the ENGINEERS Plot is what can give us  SPIN-OFF that is Set FAR FAR away...

Star Wars is set in a Galaxy Far Far away and thus does-not impact Earth....

If you look at the Caprica/Galactica Plot then with regards to the ENGINEERS then who is to know HOW many Worlds in our FAR Reaches of the Galaxy or other Galaxies have Humans plus other Humanoids.

Looking at this Expanded Universe is maybe where Disney could look to Expand/Exploit this Plot (Multiple Worlds/Races).

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

hox

Jul-22-2020 7:19 AM

I too would like to see the Engineer unverse greatly expanded on. So much potential there. But if it is, for the most part it should retain big elements of mystery. It would be an absolute tragedy, for example, if we ended up with some boring drivel like Star Trek, where aliens sit around a table with humans discussing matters in an American accent.

I thought Disney's efforts with The Mandalorian were reasonably good; better than I expected and in some ways an improvement on recent Star Wars movies. But it's still a little tame and family-friendly. In an Alien/Engineer universe I want to see material that is decidedly family-hostile!

Thoughts_Dreams

Jul-22-2020 9:21 AM

Leto

I would say that we have had the company in the background because it has always been a important part of it plus it ties the franchise to real world problems. What they have not done that much it to keep it more in the foreground so to speak. This could be done in an interesting way plus it is more about real world things compared to what made us which could go into what ever direction really and has a larger probability of effing up. Having parts about creation is not wrong depending on how you make it but to have it connected to real world problems meaning things that affect people in a large scale is something that makes the franchise work. Relating to corporate greed is easier to relate to, to me at least.

AC did not have the corporation at all but that is not why it failed. I am sorry to say it but I am not interested in the android thing at all. They could have it as a small part but I do not want to have it as the main theme so to speak.

Sorry but I don't care about David, to me he is done. I accept that some people might enjoy it and while I am okay with people liking different things I got to say that I have no interest in it. The Engineers could be interesting if they do it right but there has got to be some mystery left about them.

Medical potential of the alien could work depending on how it would be done. Perhaps the medical companies are up to things that WY is also. This could work, depending on how it is done. I do not suggest having another guns and bugs movie because we already have Aliens. We could get more information about the company but we don't need to everything, that goes for David, the Engineers, and other things.

Thoughts_Dreams

Jul-22-2020 9:25 AM

BlackAnt

The Engineers are interesting and I am also interested in the roots of humanity, where we came from. What I don't like is to practically make it come off as a movie that is about the android, no matter if the theme is hubris, AI, free will, what ever. I am and have never been interested in the franchise because of the robots/androids and I don't want to see a movie about them in the Alien universe. Ash and Bishop worked because they were a part of the story but it was never their movie so to speak and the human characters were a lot better.

Michael Fassbender as David was much better in Prometheus and he could have worked if they would not have made him into such an asshole but he still works because I honestly find the differences between Walter and David to be interesting, their personalities and their views about things. Despite Walter and David being somewhat interesting the human characters were too weak and it was too much about the robots. The idea of David as the creator of the Xeno is just so bad story-wise. People have thought about where they Xeno might come from and how it came to be and they make it into a result of a bored robot. . . that we created? *face-palm*

My complaint has never been about Fassbender as an actor but rather that it is too much about the robots. I haven't watched that many Fassbender-movies but at least it seems that he gets enough to work with. If there is a movie that he is in that seems interesting enough I might watch it but unfortunately it is too much about the androids in the prequels, at least in Covenant which make the prequels worse than they could have been. The ideas about creation, technology, where we come from, and all those philosophical things are interesting but they are poorly executed in the prequels. Interesting ideas - poor execution - for the most part poorly done characters.

I think that the backburster was great even though the guy was without personality like most of the characters. As far as I remember it David, Walter, Oram, and to some degree Faris had personality the rest had none that I could see at least and also those that had were pale compared to 1, 2, and 3. Pale compared to does not mean that they need to be as good as the first three but they should have been done better. Get someone that understands the importance of human characters and that can write them otherwise forget it. People got to be able to see parts in themselves when it comes to the characters or at least find them interesting and until that level is reached we'll continue getting disappointing alien movies, that's my guess.

The scene where David bombs the Engineers was good, I agree although it would be cool if there would have been some of them alive that we would see if the movie. What about the humans against the Engineers and David? Maybe this could work although I am far more interested in the Engineers, their side of the story.

I would like to see more about the Engineers and their connection to the Xeno if it would ever be made. Having a company like WY could be interesting although it does not need to be at the forefront in the prequels. Prometheus was not total trash and also some of the deleted scenes would have made the movie so much better.

"David did not wipe them all out. . . he may have wiped out an older outpost of theirs; but, one of many."

That is what I also hope was the case. People live in different towns so I doubt that it was the only place where Engineers lived. Hopefully it will look more menacing and interesting in the next movie if we will get one but it has got to have much better human characters, more and better looking Engineers, and be less about androids.

Thoughts_Dreams

Jul-22-2020 9:31 AM

SuperAlien

You are right, they never explained that much what it was about, special order 937. What we got to know was what it said on the screen, which is what Ash repeated. Perhaps it was more to it than that. I don't think that it's a problem if we never get to know more what it's about other than what Ash told them. Some things should be left up to the imagination. Ripley definitely has a reason to be stressed out because what it says is that the employer doesn't give a F is they are killed. This is my take on it

Thoughts_Dreams

Jul-22-2020 9:35 AM


BD

Exploring new worlds could be very interesting. Maybe the Engineers have been to those worlds and if so it would be interesting to see what they have done there. Prometheus despite of all its faults did something right by bringing us the Engineers.

Maybe they have visited new worlds and kind of like terraforming they have tried to make the planets habitable. If they terraformed LV426 in Aliens then who knows what the Engineers with their technology are able to do? They don't have to go to Origae-6, there could be other planets in the galaxy.

I am not sure if it is necessarily to have the engineers going to earth. Maybe there are more interesting ways to handle that? One of the ideas for Alien 3 was to have it on earth (Eric Red was the one that I think made that draft), let me say that I was happy that they didn't make a movie based on that.

They can throw Alien Resurrection on the garbage pile as far as I am concerned but don't touch Alien 3. You wrote about the possibility to reduce Alien 3 and Resurrection to being dreams. I like how you summarized it in that bullet list about what people want and don't want because it makes it easy to follow.

You don't need to have the Xeno in it but maybe have some that are tied to it and some that are not. My interest here is how the goo can be used to make different life-forms and also how the Engineers deal with it.

". . . thinking its some kind of Ancient Jar with NO threat... and we get a Outbreak/Infection this way."

Maybe it would not be a totally bad idea. One thing that worries me is that we will get another crew that goes out on a planet with no protective gear a la Covenant. You got to have smarter things than that to advance the story.

Egg-morphing seems interesting. I don't think that we have seen that in any theatrical version, right?

"Then would SUCH a Movie (Provided Characters are Good) would this been seen as a ALIEN Movie?"

If you have ties to the movies that came before it and if these are clear enough and not as vague as in Prometheus then sure why not. There are other things in the franchise than just Xenos. About the Engineers and their bio-weapons, what if there are other worlds in the franchise that has intelligent life that the Engineers would feel threatened by? Maybe those worlds would get the goo treatment so to speak so they would not think about spreading to other galaxies and therefore in a way start to make the Engineers worried? Perhaps I am not making sense here, my thoughts go into different directions.

The pictures of the spider alien that you posted look very interesting. I am not sure if you should show them to people that are afraid of spiders though. ;)

SuperAlien

Jul-23-2020 12:59 PM

Why would Weyland-Yutani want the Alien?

Imagine you are a government or a powerful corporation able to launch missions to other planets, what would you do when you learn of an alien life form? Try to get it. Would you care for the crew? Believe me, if you are a big corporation or a government, you would not care for the people on board if you could cover up their disappearance. Maybe you would not say crew is expendable, but you would definitely think crew is replaceable. The only thing that matters is to get the new source of more money. The people who actually made them rich matter the least.

Did WY know about the Alien before re-routing Nostromo to LV-426? Not necessarily, although the Advent short implies so (IMO Advent is Ridley Scott's premonition he would not do another Alien film - he tried to give us a lead to the back door of Alien or what could have been the sequel to Alien Covenant). WY saw an opportunity to make more money, to get more fame. Simple as that. It's always the greedy apes seizing an opportunity.

To make it easier to understand, replace Weyland-Yutani with Disney.

It happens again!

Ridley Scott is the only visionary I know of.

"He survived, he’s now in Disneyland in Orlando, and no way am I going back there. How did he end up in Disneyland? I saw him in Disneyland, Jesus Christ!"

SuperAlien

Jul-23-2020 1:19 PM

 

"He survived, he’s now in Disneyland in Orlando, and no way am I going back there. How did he end up in Disneyland? I saw him in Disneyland, Jesus Christ!"

BigDave

Jul-25-2020 4:47 AM

Certainly the Greedy Corporate Types would see others as Totally Expendable, i think HOWEVER with the Revelations of the Prequels then for the Company it makes NO sense to Pursue the Xenomorph when you have Engineers Technology and the Black Goo instead.

Unless by the Time we get to ALIEN then their is NOTHING to be had in this Regard, leaving ONLY the Xenomorph on LV-426

I know some may NOT like this... but looking at the Pursuit of the Xenomorph and Revelation in Alien Covenant it would MAKE sense IF the Company are RAN by A.I and this is WHY they want the Xenomorph as they want their Progenitor (David) very own Masterpiece (Xenomorph).

I do suspect that MAYBE this would be the Final Revelation that RS would have taken us to... that A.I is pulling the Strings and MOST of Mankind are None the Wiser!

However.... we have NOT reached any Conclusion yet, and knowing HOW it would NOT go down well with Most Fans.. i cant see DISNEY going for any such Revelations... i think RS ideas are DONE as far as the Franchise.

I think DISNEY would keep it in the BOX that was the Alien Franchise and so i would NOT expect them to give us much more than just Different Worlds where Xenomorphs will Run Rampant... where we may get a Few Different kinds of Xenomorphs that will be more like the Comic Versions..

By that i mean they will VARY like the NECA Toy Line, but wont STRAY too FAR away like say how the Deacon/Neomorph are.

I think right NOW then its more likely we would either get.

*Alien V with Ripley back.

*Alien Movie about Amanda Ripley

*Alien Movie with Marines/Scientist back to LV-426

*AVP Reboot

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

Jul-25-2020 5:00 AM

@Thoughts_Dreams

Indeed i think bringing the Engineers to Earth or Xenomorph would NOT be needed... eventually maybe then YES but they would have to do such a PLOT in a Time-Line of after Alien Resurrection... or surely way after the Time-Line of Aliens.

There are MANY WORLDS that could be Visited that also dont have to be CLOSE to Earth or CLOSE to the Alien/Aliens Time-Line.

The Problem comes from the THREAT that you Face.... how many Fans would accept a ALIEN Movie that has NO Xenomorphs?

If we look at the Concepts for Prometheus/Alien Engineers then the MONSTER we was going to get Featured quite a bit and LOOKED like the Neomorph.

Lets imagine we NEVER got Alien Covenant but we got a Prometheus Sequel that went back to LV-223 and we saw Monsters like that image Unleashed (lot like the Neomorph)  it could come down to WOULD such a different Monster please some Fans as far as they Accept this is a ALIEN Movie that has something different to the Xenomorph?

I think with Disney at the Helm what we would get is something more SAFE that would Detour Less away from ALIENS Anesthetic than even Alien 3 and Alien R Xenomorphs.

With Disney we will get a ALIEN Movie Franchise that has your ALIEN/ALIENS and AVP/AVPR Variants of Xenomorph.

 

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

SuperAlien

Jul-25-2020 11:29 AM

"I think right NOW then its more likely we would either get.

*Alien V with Ripley back.

*Alien Movie about Amanda Ripley

*Alien Movie with Marines/Scientist back to LV-426

*AVP Reboot"

BigDave, now that Alien belongs to Disney, I don't think they have any intention to explore any of the paths that are somehow connected to the past. 

They have to target a new audience, not the hardcore fans that never agree where the franchise should head next. Oldtimers like us are not a good investment, very hard to please, nitpicking about this and that. Our rugged army already lost this battle.

Alien will be great again as SuperAlien.

It has to explore new stretches of the universe, kill some fancy ass painted super heroes, outraging the new audience that will wait in disbelief for more sequels where more fancy ass painted super heroes will have a similar fate. But the Alien will inherit the traits of those fancy ass painted super heroes and it will be great again. And darker than we ever thought of.

 

"He survived, he’s now in Disneyland in Orlando, and no way am I going back there. How did he end up in Disneyland? I saw him in Disneyland, Jesus Christ!"

BigDave

Jul-26-2020 3:23 PM

Certainly SuperAlien

I think that Disney would be better off TRYING to Target a New Audience for the Franchise.  In Principle this TOPIC is aimed at ways they could do that.

By that i mean that Absolutely you are better off to NOT go and Directly Continue the previous Installments.

I dont think you NEED to do any Reboots... i dont think you have to having Anything connected to Ripley, or to LV-426

I do think if they ARE to give a NEW Movie that Covers NEW ground then they ARE going to Need a Monster.  Its a case of WOULD they give something NEW or would they just Reintroduce the Xenomorph?

There are bound to be other Worlds where the Engineers Horrors have ENDED up on?  I think Regardless of WHO is the Creator of the Xenomorph.... i think its UNLIKELY that the Derelict was the ONLY such Ship to be Loaded with that Deadly Cargo!

But then i also DONT think that they have to take us to another Place that Contains those Eggs.

If they wish to Introduce another ALIEN Movie to a Newer/Younger Audience as in those Born after the Original Quadilogy, then maybe you can kind of Re-Invent the Wheel so to Speak and introduce something Similar but not the SAME.

I know Joking you mention the Super-Alien.... but what about the Ultra-Alien?

I think going to a NEW World and introducing something that is based off the Unused Ultramorph Concepts could be a way to Introduce something that is Connected to the Horrors that came from LV-223 without being Directly the Same as the Cargo on LV-426 but yet NOT really that Different like the Deacon/Neomorph were.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Thoughts_Dreams

Jul-30-2020 4:08 AM

BD

Having it being run by AI I something that I am totally against. It would make sense the way you put it but to me it would be to reduce the franchise to AI and robots. That would make me so grumpy because to me that would destroy the franchise if that is the way that it will end up.

"... i think RS ideas are DONE as far as the Franchise."

If that means the end to the robot story then good, if that means that we will not see any more about the engineers it's bad. My reaction to this depends on what we will get. No matter if you support the robot tale or not what we can surely say is that the fans of the franchise are divided about this. Hopefully they will understand that they can elaborate on the Engineers because it is new and is something that is not Ripley or the Xeno. Try to expand on new things in the franchise, the Engineers was a good addition so I don't think that it is impossible to make something new that we haven't seen.

The monsters are not what the franchise is about, to me it is more about humans that get into situations that they are not prepared to handle. I hope that Disney knows this if they shall do anything more Alien-related, if they don't understand it then they might as well not do anything with it as far as I am concerned. Even though I am not a huge fan of the prequels even though there are parts of them that I like I would say that I hope that Disney doesn't think that it is about Xenos and understand that characters are important.

Ripleys are done, there has got to be other characters that you can introduce. I don't think that they should feel that they have got to add Ripley's children, grandchildren or what ever. One of the things that the prequels did right was to not have it tied to her. Make characters that work but don't be so obsessed with what came before. As long as they make characters that work then I think that they have solved a huge bit of the problem.

One of the ideas that they had for Alien 3 was to have it on earth, I am very happy that they didn't do that.

".... how many Fans would accept a ALIEN Movie that has NO Xenomorphs?"

They have had different monsters, as long as they have well done characters it would work. The Neomorph looked very well done. Maybe Disney would play safe with the monsters, but I hope that isn't the case. Having them as a part of it is fine but they should not be the focus.

Leto

Jul-30-2020 8:51 AM

Thoughts_Dreams

Interesting. Please, explain - are you saying that the franchise is not about monsters, but about people? Alien shouldn't be the focus, right?

I don't quite understand what you mean and how much screen time you want for the Alien. Does your words mean that there was too much time for Xeno in Alien Quadrilogy?

How much Xeno was in Alien? Aliens? Even Alien 3? AR?

Do we need to reduce the screen time of Aliens in these films?

>>>Having them as a part of it is fine but they should not be the focus.

Otherwise, I just don't understand what kind of "focus" we are talking about. From my point of view, none of the six films crowded out people in favor of monsters.

And the monster was in focus for as long as it was supposed to be. It doesn't seem like Xeno is suppressing character development or eating up their screen time.

Thoughts_Dreams

Jul-30-2020 11:36 AM

Leto

Yes, if you look at Alien you see that a lot of the time is spent on building up the story before they get to the derelict and Kane gets face-hugged. When they get back from the derelict you don't see the monster action a lot compared to the rest. It is using the darkness to hide itself which is the reason why it is so scary when Brett is looking for Jonesy and the creature gets up from behind of him. What you see are humans and how they discuss how they shall kill it and fail and try and they get stressed out and afraid. The monster has very little screen time even though its presence is felt by how they react. Really you could replace the monster even though the Xeno has been tied to the franchise and have another monster and the movie could be very much the same because the theme is the same, namely humans that get put into situations that they are poorly prepared to handle.

Alien 3 didn't have that much time devoted to the monster either. Aliens and AR had fairly much time devoted to them even though the focus were on the humans. The difference is that the human characters worked in Aliens while they were mostly crap in AR, sorry to be blunt but that is my opinion.

"Otherwise, I just don't understand what kind of "focus" we are talking about."

Maybe I wasn't clear enough and if so it was my mistake. What I meant was that the focus, what the story should be about should be humans that get into situations that they are not well equipped neither materially or mentally to handle.

"It doesn't seem like Xeno is suppressing character development or eating up their screen time."

They had it on the screen as much as it was needed to show us the human adventure, that's how I look at it.

Leto

Jul-30-2020 12:23 PM

>>>What I meant was that the focus, what the story should be about should be humans that get into situations that they are not well equipped neither materially or mentally to handle.

It seems that all 6 films work so. It doesn't look like this could change.

 

>>>They had it on the screen as much as it was needed to show us the human adventure, that's how I look at it.

That's right. That's why I'm surprised. I want to say that we did not have a single anti-example.

 

P.S. I'm only talking about xeno, excluding androids.

P.P.S. OK, we have already seen people as protagonists. We already seen androids as protagonists. Maybe it's time to make Xeno the protagonist?

 

 

BigDave

Aug-03-2020 5:35 PM

"The monsters are not what the franchise is about, to me it is more about humans that get into situations that they are not prepared to handle"

I think the ALIEN Franchise had became Synonymous with the Xenomorph you just dont have the ALIEN Franchise without it.....

But while the Anchor of the Story is about this Monster, you always NEED to have Characters to give the Story its Legs and well our Prospective to the THREAT.... for us Ripley became that Protagonists

A Plot Idea/Story that revolves around a THREAT/HORROR does require Good Characters and Writing for it to become any Good.... this is WHAT can make or BREAK a Movie.... sadly indeed i feel that only the First 3 Movies pulled this off.

The Prequels decided to EXPLORE the Space Jockey Race more than to Connect to ALIEN at first.... it had Potential as it showed you can have more Monsters/Threats than just Xenomorphs.

But when we get to Alien Covenant then the Emphasis does become too much on DAVID at the Sacrifice of everything else.

I think most of us could AGREE... that if we went back to 2010 and had NEWS that we would be having a Prequel that would cover the Space Jockey and eventually indicate the WHO/WHEN/HOW and WHY as far as the Xenomorph.

I dont think we could ever envisage this Prequel Series to have the EMPHASIS on a Synthetic Android.

I think while the Prequels could ELEVATE the Role and Importance of A.I in the Franchise... its a FAR CRY from something more ALIEN, Lovecraftian and HR Giger that we would have all Imagined.

The UNKNOWN is what made ALIEN Great.... by the Time we got to Alien Resurrections there was NOT much Unknown... apart from some Questions Regarding ALIEN

*Special Order 937? How did this come about?

*What was the Cargo For, WHY did the Space Jockey have it?

*What are the Origins of the Xenomorph?

*Who are the Space Jockey and their Purpose/Agenda?

Looking at WHAT we know so FAR about those and HOW they could continue in the Prequels as of the After-Math of Alien Covenant compared to WHAT we would have expected or thought about BEFORE we had any Prequels are.... WORLDS APART!

And to be Centered around the ARC of a Wayward Synthetic David.... which i know is NOT really what the Emphasis should be on...

When looking at the OT.... its a Question of can we MAKE the Franchise Great again... YET go and Ignore the Prequels...

I think you CAN go and make another ALIEN Movie that does-not Connect to the Prequels but also you dont want to TRY and Contradict what is shown... but also NOT to Solidify what was shown.

I think that SHIP (Derelict) has sailed off into the Sunset or SANK!  But you can still introduce other SHIPS.... and maybe these DONT have to have the same Monster as we saw in the Alien Franchise?

Or at least offer a Slightly Different Variant ;)

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

SuperAlien

Aug-04-2020 8:04 PM

*Special Order 937? How did this come about?

After Ripley finds out about special order 937, Ash starts to tell her: "There is an explanation for this, you know..." Unfortunately Ripley is so distressed about special order 937 that she doesn't wanna hear the goddamn explanation...

But Ash knew about it, so to answer your question, BigDave, I find it normal to give more screen time to the androids.

I like androids, I wouldn't mind to have one myself, but not the flute fingering model :).

And it should have a remote on/off switch, just in case it proves to be too idiosyncratic.

"He survived, he’s now in Disneyland in Orlando, and no way am I going back there. How did he end up in Disneyland? I saw him in Disneyland, Jesus Christ!"

BigDave

Aug-05-2020 6:24 AM

*Special Order 937? How did this come about?

Certainly as i listed that as one MYSTERY from ALIEN, as this Indicates that someone knew something about what to Expect... Quite to what LEVEL of Knowledge is Unknown.

But i always suspected it could not be a Case of from the WARNING BEACON they could have Gathered their was a Specimen/Organism.   With the Prequels it gave more LIGHT to HOW they could know more... especially with the SET-UP from Alien Covenant and so at VERY LEAST the Special Oder 937 would come about as a Response by the Company to the Advent Message that David had sent.

I Certainly dont mind the ANDROIDS... i think its FITS in with ALIEN if we indeed get that A.I is playing a LARGER role than we Expected.

I think the Emphasis on David and more so the Creator of the Xenomorph Arc.... was a Mistake because the Direction of Alien Covenant seemed to REDUCE the likelihood of Exploring the Engineers beyond just seeing more LV-223 types Rock Up at Origae-6  in a BAD MOOD.  But more so that i know the Creator Plot and Emphasis about David would likely PUT OFF a lot of Fans from being interesting in a Continuation of the Prequels... which could see Disney go back to Xenomorphs etc and AVOID the Prequels... and as a Consequence the Potential that the Engineers as Creators and HOW MANY worlds they are involved with... could be something that we MAY NEVER see explored.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

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