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The Derelict and the Juggernaut – From the Same Factory…

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Ati

PraetorianMember3378 XPJun-15-2017 5:17 PM

’Ridley had decided that the derelict ship in the first Alien was one of the group that had gone off and his cargo had gotten out of control, and the space jockey died in the process. So that ship happened to be as it were a brother to the Juggernaut that we see coming out of the ground in Prometheus. They were made roughly the same period give or take a hundred years.

Rick Stammers as special effects supervisor was made aware it might have come from the same factory as the one in Alien, and there again they are not the same ship, it had less emphasis on the bones and organic shapes that were present in Giger's work. Beyond that there is no real link between the two, but it shows who may have had these capabilities to have dreadful weapons beyond anything we could possibly conceive, as sort of bacteriological drums of awful substance that you can drop on a planet.

Because the Juggernaut was carefully stored away underground, Conor O'Sullivan talked about how the details on the walls and the ground are much finer and better defined because the environment is meant to be in almost mint condition.’

Richard  Stammers (Special Effects Supervisor): The Juggernaut might look like it has come from the same factory as the derelict in Alien, but it is not the same ship. The exterior shape is similar, but it has way more detail; and inside, it had a little less emphasis on bones and organic shapes  than were present in Giger’s work. We had two practical set pieces representing the juggernaut, with doorways again resembling an orifice of questionable nature. (Cinefex 130, p59)

Collider interview with Ridley Scott (2012):

Steve 'Frosty' Weintraub :

Can you talk about approaching how you wanted the technology to look in this movie? Because it’s unclear when it is relative to Alien, but this is more advanced technology that they are using than other people have been in Alien.

Ridley Scott: 

Yeah, but I couldn’t help that, because I didn’t know, did I? (Laughs) For all intents and purposes this is very loosely a prequel, very, and then you say “But how did that ship evolve in the first Alien?” Then I would say “Actually he’s one of the group that had gone off and his cargo had gotten out of control,” because he was heading somewhere else and it got out of control and actually he had died in the process and that would be the story there. That ship happened to be a brother to the ship that you see that comes out of the ground at the end. They are roughly of the same period give or take a couple hundred years, right? Other than that, there’s no real link except it explains, I think, who may have had these capabilities, which are dreadful weapons way beyond anything we could possibly conceive, bacteriological drums of **** that you can drop on a planet. -- (http://collider.com, June 1st 2012)

4 Responses to The Derelict and the Juggernaut – From the Same Factory…

Ripleys_Ghost

FacehuggerMember210 XPJun-15-2017 8:19 PM

Good topic.  But, I'm always kind of disappointed by the non-canon 'theories' posited by those involved in the film.  Just when it seems that it's going someplace, they'll contract the story later on, nothing is solved, and it's more confusing than ever.  Overall, the change in style from a creepy bio-mech world to a mechanical one was disappointing.

awakened

OvomorphMember21 XPJun-15-2017 11:56 PM

So the SJ was killed by a first gen Goomorph burster (think like a variant of the Neo) that he was infected with from direct contact with the Goo in the cargo.

Roughly 1900-2100 years ago.

Not a second gen classic xeno breeded/engineered by David in modern day (20 years before Alien).

So to make it all work the second gen xeno ovomorphs we see in Alien had to be planted in the already-crashed-and-fossilized derelict very recently, maybe by David in the next movie (or better he will bring a queen on LV426, not necessarily the same queen we see decades later in Aliens).

BigDave

DeaconMember10115 XPJun-16-2017 7:32 AM

Nice to touch upon these again ATI Thanks for sharing.

In another interview i cant remember where but i can try and source it.

RS has basically said regarding the Space Jockey that this event (Derelict on LV-426) had happened within a few hundred years of the Outbreak on LV-223... so 1800-2200 Ball Mark...

He went on to say the ship was leaving to go someplace (never said where) but it did not get FAR (hint it departed from LV-223?)  The Pilot got infected with his Cargo and set down on LV-426 to Quarantine the Ship.

He Evolved this with a latter interview where he had said the Space Jockey had been infected by his own Cargo, something had EVOLVED in the Cargo Hold and got to the Space Jockey

Other points RS had made in the past after Prometheus with the Space Jockey are as follows.

*The Derelict did not Crash... he was bugged why people think it crashed, but he did hint it was more a attempted landing....   (thus he knew he was infected and tried to head to Baron LV-426 and must have Chest Busted during the Final Seconds of landing).

*The Space Jockey is a Engineer

*The Technology of the Ships is maybe Millions of years old (which has to be Juggernaught/Derelict as the Pebble ship is definitely Hundreds of Millions of years old).

*The Juggernaught and Derelict are the same kinds of Ships, the Juggernaught is in New Pristine Condition and the Derelict is a Ancient Wreck.

Some of these wont add up to other comments, but it gives the idea that the Derelict and Juggernaught are the same or similar... added to other interview that ATI put where RS mentions about 100 years difference in both ships... its a case of is ONE a New/Older Model of the other?  a Evolution? Re-Engineering?  Or  did the Derelict Evolve from the Juggernaught somehow?

i am sure Lindeloff hinted before, and Wayne Haag in his interview also considered similar.... that the ENGINEERS Technology is Borrowed/Stolen.

so its all up on the AIR when we consider all these comments..

One one hand it could hint at the Derelict leaving LV-223 after the Outbreak a few hundred years after, which could back up any theory that the Cargo had Evolved and maybe even altered the Ship too.

Or it could hint that it left LV-223 or some other place a few Hundred years prior ..... thus this would back up any theory the Engineers discovered the Derelict and Re-Engineered it... even as far as maybe this is how they obtained the Xeno-DNA to then conduct all the LV-223 Experiments.

So open  was the debate.... the problem with these theories still is the Star Maps which date back way way before the LV-223 Outbreak...

BUT ALAS....

We dont know where RS is going now, it looks likely that David created those Eggs and you can bet that RS does not care about a Few Oversights...

*Space Jockey Size.

*Difference between Juggernaught/Derelict Aesthetically

because he was never concerned with how the Juggernaught/Derelict are not identical and even how the AC Paradise Engineers do not look quite the same as those in Prometheus..

They are Oversights...

And so i would not be surprised if the Derelict is Shown and it looks more like the Juggernaught than Derelict and the Pilot is well Space Jockey Prometheus Size Suit... that contains a Human/Synthetic.

They would be just oversights... like the Xenomorph Infection/Gestation and Growth in AC

 

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Ati

PraetorianMember3378 XPJun-17-2017 2:04 PM

BigDave - Thank you for your comment full of info.

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