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Ridley Scott confirms David WAS the originator of the xenomorph AND that the beings he bombarded were in fact engineers.

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QueenElizabethShaw

ChestbursterMember554 XPMay-25-2017 11:17 AM

According to Ridley Scott, the beings David bombed were in fact engineers. He addresses this in the recent podcast with Empire magazine and he also indicates that David DID create the original xenomorph, not the engineers.

The podcast can be listened to here and both of these admissions are discussed between the time stamps
26:47 - 27:36.

Thoughts?

95 Responses to Ridley Scott confirms David WAS the originator of the xenomorph AND that the beings he bombarded were in fact engineers.

QueenElizabethShaw

ChestbursterMember554 XPMay-25-2017 4:42 PM

Blackwinter-witch

I share that exact concern. I know Ridley is a true visionary but even the art of a visionary can be damaged by the Corporate side of things. I will continue to entertain best/worst case scenarios, but will try not to get too far swept into either camp.

Really there's just some people I've seen on this forum that may as well be pouting and stamping their feet. The hostility and presumptuous dismissal of the entire thing is absurd. Right now we are being kept in suspense until we get more information. Ridley may have baked all this into the project purposefully for that reason. To provoke emotions.

It's just hard to tell. I will say my biggest gripe with how he's handling this centers on one particular risk.

Let's say Scott is in fact a genius who is purposefully bating us into distress because he knows at the end he is going to give all of us what we want. That creating these kinds of perceived shortcomings, then fixing them all in the final film would create even more acclaim for the trilogy when all is said and done. Even if that is the case, if Scott dies before completing the follow up films, then Hill and Giler take over, everything could be run straight into the ground in an even more extraordinarily horrific way than any of us can even imagine. Let's hope that doesn't end up being the case.

djamelameziane

FacehuggerMember143 XPMay-25-2017 4:43 PM

Well i did not like Prometheus and i actually think AC was two steps forward one step back so still better but still with a big WTF is going on moments! Better more believable characters actions etc.  But the story line hmm...

Even though i didn't like a lot of Prometheus it still had that awe factor in parts and Ridley mentioned a demi god many many races levels and a vastness that is space.  That all seems to be disappearing. 

The engineers are smaller weaker and have a sense of being not even as powerful as humans :s . In this film. David making the xenos sucks all the vastness mystery and fun out of them for me.  So we are talking a bit of nano tech that carries the black goo mutagen and David a creation of only 150 years of computing evolution beat these hulking millions of years old beings then used their stuff to do things better than them :O ? 

The graphic novels with the harsh home world evolving these creatures over millions of years to become amazing biological killing machines had way more potential... and the multiple races demi god stuff was the best with the idea in alien that the space jockey half been there for 100000 years or more... all that vastness feels so tiny with a basic android with 10 years on his hands... hmm so confusing. 

 

David doesn't sleep doesn't get tired has super speed  accuracy and strength. 10 years and kind of has a few small rooms with what looks like almost no technology? I would if thought he could of reorganized the engineers city into something way more impressive?! Anyway many more thoughts... sigh...

 

 

 "It's almost as if they are making it up as they go along" :D

Phallic Jaw

FacehuggerMember265 XPMay-25-2017 4:52 PM

Two words:  Jack Daniels.

I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion.  I watched Androids blow and finger each other's flutes.

cryofodder

OvomorphMember49 XPMay-25-2017 4:52 PM

Let’s not write the series off yet.     Alien: Covenant will generate a profit!   I noticed that the movie Is running up against “Guardians of the Galaxy 2” and not even in 3D at my theatre.   A lot of people haven’t seen it yet!

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-25-2017 4:53 PM

So according to Ridley Scott the Engineers can only visit us every 500 years but now humans are traveling to their star system every 10 years or so?

djamelameziane

FacehuggerMember143 XPMay-25-2017 4:58 PM

 As for why this is all no were near the original alien films level.  It feels like the ideas man was obannon we don't have anyone like him driving this now. Gieger was the mind blowing alien injection that's also losing it's strength with no new angles. Even things like the alien film beginning shot with the slow waking up of the cryo stasis pods white room was so brilliant ...better designed ship ... taking it's time... the slow pace which added to the feeling of being in space. So real and great acting great characters... and that music... thank god they are using it again that's brilliant...

 "It's almost as if they are making it up as they go along" :D

Blackwinter-witch

PraetorianMember2861 XPMay-25-2017 5:03 PM

QueenElizabethShaw

Giler and Hill taking the helm of this franchise is a genuine nightmare, I agree! I take it you are probably aware of what they tried with the original first movie?

I agree with your points and you have a good, logical perspective. I will continue to stick with the franchise, though I reserve the right to ***** about things. :)
But I won't give up on it, not yet, not until the next film lays down the final cards.

And maybe not even then, unless they hand it over to Giler and Hill.
If the execs do that, then yeah, I will run far and fast from that bilious nightmare of idiocy before it even gets rolling.

IN SPACE THERE IS NO WARNING

 

 

 

Tiwaz

ChestbursterMember528 XPMay-25-2017 5:05 PM

@QES

That Book went through FOX's approval, before it was published.

I'm slowly thinking Riddler is "missing a few cups in the cabinet" as germans tend to say. He stated "The Engineers did't create him... David did...". "Him" of course could mean the AC-Xeno. It's slowly becoming a farce if you ask me. 

Eine Theorie die nicht auf Etwas solidem basiert ist für gewöhnlich nur Geschwätz.

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-25-2017 5:05 PM

djamelameziane Whoever did the set design of the Covenant just went to Best buy and got a bunch of tv monitors of several sizes. Whenever I see the characters gathered at the "bridge" it looks to me I'm watching the behind the scenes of a film about broadcast news.

AdamPD

FacehuggerMember198 XPMay-25-2017 5:40 PM

The beings on the 4th planet being engineers, I can understand and accept

They kinda reminded me of the Minbari from Babylon 5, the same race, but three casts.

Warrior caste, Religious and Worker.

I assume this planet had the religious type cast, who, like the Amish, choose not to include technology in their lives.

But, it makes no sense stating David made the original xenomorph

There's just too many glaring issues with that which have been rehashed on this forum many times.

I mean MAYBE the engineers come back to their paradise world, find it decimated, but also find the eggs, so they put the eggs on a transport version of a juggernaut, it somehow flies into a black hole and is transported back into the past (Like the spaceship from Sphere lol) and crashes on LV426.

Heh, who knows!

Svanya

PraetorianAdmin4298 XPMay-25-2017 6:01 PM

I feel so bad for Shaw... She got turned into a nighmarish birthing machine. Good to see some Giger imagery though. Also, i'm pretty sure Walter isn't dead. I was thinking maybe he gets facehugged by one of the eggs David created, and he uses the crashed juggernaught ship to escape the planet and send the warning that the Nostromo picks up. He's the guy in the chair the crew of the Nostromo find, not an engineer. The biomech xeno comes from him. 

QueenElizabethShaw

ChestbursterMember554 XPMay-25-2017 6:30 PM

Tiwaz

"That Book went through FOX's approval, before it was published."

That brings me to my third guess (which I should have included in my last response to you)

I work for a large corporation that produces digital content. I regularly see major shortcomings on the part of reviewers. Some of the things that are missed are truly mind blowing. It may be the case that this little nugget slipped through the cracks and now Ridley and the book are out of sync with each other. Ridley may not even realize that the book indicates that David didn't create the egg. If that is the case, we might be in for a grade A ****show over the next couple of years.

Perhaps someone should put this question to Ridley or ADF sooner than not.

QueenElizabethShaw

ChestbursterMember554 XPMay-25-2017 6:47 PM

joylitt

"So according to Ridley Scott the Engineers can only visit us every 500 years but now humans are traveling to their star system every 10 years or so?"

What do you mean?

Blackwinter-witch

PraetorianMember2861 XPMay-25-2017 6:49 PM

I'll say that trying to work around what the franchise is doing and create a decent story in the ALIENverse isn't easy, and is getting to be quite a challenge in attempting to resolve via logical extrapolation various plot-holes, loopholes and continuity issues.

I may only be writing fanfiction, but I am giving it my best effort. I want to make something the fanbase will enjoy, and possibly salve some of the bruises inflicted by what's going on in the franchise right now.

That all said, there's no way around some points, so there's going to be unavoidable de-couplings from Canon that exist from certain dualities as mentioned above Re; Book vs Film where they can not be resolved properly.

Then again, inspiration might strike in the middle of the night and lend it's aid. We'll see, and in the meantime, I'll keep working.

But if your a 'David groupie', you'll be sorely disappointed as my works do not encompass him much.

IN SPACE THERE IS NO WARNING

 

 

 

BigDave

DeaconMember10193 XPMay-25-2017 6:55 PM

"here really was no other motivation behind it, besides giving a nod to the master (Giger)"

Its possible, i agree at that... but i think the Face Huggers was the Easter Eggs, i think regardless the Mural shows us a Xenomorph related Organism, the Black Goo shows us Xeno-related Outcomes (Hammerpedes and Fifield, and Trillobite to Deacon).  Plus the Black Goo creates a lot of Davids work... then we have the Frescos... which we only see the one clearly.

If these are just Easter Eggs... FOX needs to stop doing silly stuff, because it wrongly sets Fans up the Wrong Garden Path which then leads to Fans then being let down and disappointed.. The Alien Covenant Poster with those Xenomorphs and Engineers is a prime example.

Easter Eggs like the Drinking Bird are fine....but things that can be interpreted to the Plot like the Mural in Prometheus and the Alien Covenant Engineer Poster... are just setting Fans up for major disapointments

 

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-25-2017 7:08 PM

QueenElizabethShaw Did you listen to the whole podcast? Ridley said the Engineers visit us every 500 years. But we visit their planets every 10 years or so. And imagine if other space faring civilizations they have seeded are doing the same?

BigDave

DeaconMember10193 XPMay-25-2017 7:13 PM

The Egg Scene in the Novel is interesting... i thought it was not mentioned? Are there alternative Novels? i doubt it.

If indeed its hinted David did not create but found it, then that did raise a lot of Questions..  when RS made a comment just after he announced AC he did mention this.

“They’re going to go to the planet where the engineers came from, and come across the evolving creature that they had made. Why did they make it? Why would they make such a terrifying beast? It felt bio-mechanoid, it felt like a weapon. And so the movie will explain that, and reintroduce the alien back into it.”

You could interpreted that as THEY as in Engineers...

If the ADF Novel has that Scene where David tells Oram he came across the Egg....  this adds up to the quote by RS.

We need to remember a Lot of Changes happen post shooting, and re-shoots and so the information that Alan Dean was working off would not be 100% the finished product we had the the Cinema...

Things get changed... Prometheus is Proof of this with the many scenes that it never included... which not only was the Elders Scenes, but Scenes like this.

That paint a different picture of some Scenes, but are edited out and so are not to be considered as far as Canon.

The ADF Egg Scene therefore is just a victim of again changes to plans as they are in the Post Shooting/Re-shooting phase.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-25-2017 7:15 PM

It is also very interesting to hear from Ridley himself how uninterested he is in the action aspect of the film, he actually calls it "shoot 'em up bull****". He kinda suggests he was only invested in that second act and Fassbender's "standout scene". I am not sure what he means about the David/Walter switching twist though. I'm not sure he's proud about the cheap trick he pulled on us.

BigDave

DeaconMember10193 XPMay-25-2017 7:20 PM

@Svanya

I can see what you mean, i was always under the impression that Walter may be not quite a normal Synthetic and he would be part of how we get the Bio-Mechanical Xenomorph.

Its a nice theory, but i would imagine the Juggernaught is incapacitated, as we have to Question why David was stranded unless he wanted to stay on purpose until he can Lure in Test Subjects.

A theory on Walter on that ship and getting Chest Busted would also hint that what ever Chest Bursts would be a Egg Layer... but i think RS is going against a Queen for his plans.

I certainly think at some point a Synthetic and a Engineer Ship have to come back into play as far as leading to ALIEN, and we have to ask... are we really going to see David with one Hand all the way in the next movie?

I think surely the Covenant would have Spare Parts for Walter that David can use... and maybe what if there is enough to Rebuild a Walter?

If David does this and used MUTHUR to allow David to upload his consciousness to this Walter... then killing off Daniels would cover all his tracks..

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

QueenElizabethShaw

ChestbursterMember554 XPMay-25-2017 7:22 PM

joylitt

I see now. You are referencing the content from the podcast. Do you have a time stamp? I did listen to the whole thing but the only reference to 500 years that I remember picking up on was this one

"If the planet went wrong, they would want to wipe it clean. But that could take 500 years. When they revisit –  because different visitors would come back and see we’re not doing so well – they would look at these human beings that are jerks, that are killing the planet, killing themselves, can’t settle down, they’re like a bunch of children. We should wipe it clean."

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-25-2017 7:28 PM

That's what I'm talking about. Anyway they visit us very sporadically, but we got to a point where we can be at their doorstep whenever we want. That is very bad planning on behalf on the engineers, and I don't think it will ever be explained.

QueenElizabethShaw

ChestbursterMember554 XPMay-25-2017 7:35 PM

joylitt

I think you've misinterpreted what he said. I don't gather anything like that at all from his words.

BigDave

DeaconMember10193 XPMay-25-2017 7:38 PM

All i can think of to the 500 years is..

This is how regular the Engineers visit Worlds they seed to check on the Progress... Or this is how long after HITTING Reset, before they can begin Re-creating Life again on those Worlds.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Ati

PraetorianMember3378 XPMay-25-2017 7:39 PM

There's no contradiction regarding where the eggs are from, David is not telling the truth. He is lying in the movie as well.

 

BigDave

DeaconMember10193 XPMay-25-2017 7:41 PM

@joylitt

I can see where you are comming from and for sure, thats correct.. but i think the Engineers felt that Mankind would never evolve Technologically to be able to do that...  this shows the Hubris of the Engineers, their Arrogance and Naivety that they see their creations as limited without the Knowledge and Help they pass on.

Ultimately is why Prometheus was Punished lol

 

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

chli

ChestbursterMember935 XPMay-26-2017 12:13 AM

In the interview, we also get an explanation for the ship's name, "Covenant". It corresponds to the agreements made between the pilgrim fathers who left their homeland and went on a similar journey to the promised land.

Svanya

PraetorianAdmin4298 XPMay-26-2017 5:30 AM

@BigDave 

"Its a nice theory, but i would imagine the Juggernaught is incapacitated"~BigDave

True, but they were on an engineer planet, perhaps the main planet, so i'd wager it's highly possible there are more ships there. As for Daniels and the rest of the crew/passengers, it's obvious David will use them all as test subjects, infecting them with the facehuggers brought onboard and continuing his research. He did say he intended to do to Daniels exactly as he had done to Shaw.

@QueenElizabethShaw I've featured this thread, thanks for posting it!

Kongzilla

ChestbursterMember666 XPMay-26-2017 6:20 AM

"This is going to mean the Covenant is leaving Planet 4 in around the year 2105 (mid December 2104) and will take 7 years to get to Origae-6 and then that puts us at the year late 2111 and early 2112 which then leaves them 9-10 years to Shoe-horn David and his Eggs to LV-426 which bare in mind if he does not discover a Engineer ship on Origae-6 means another 7 years back to Earth or say 5-7 back to LV-426 Potentially putting the Derelict on LV-426 as being there for 3-5 years before the events of Alien."

 

Wait! Who said that Alien happening in 2122? Original movie haven't information about time! David can have many years and decades before Alien. This maybe 22XX or 23XX for Alien79 hapening.

Tonehound

FacehuggerMember146 XPMay-26-2017 6:28 AM

These following lines take on a new meaning and clarity when replaced with RS speaking of his A L I E N legacy … -

"We made you because we could."

"Sometimes to create, one must first destroy."

"It must feel like your God abandoned you."

"Did you really think I was gonna sit in a boardroom for years arguing over who was in charge while you go look for some miracle on some godforsaken rock in the middle of space? A king has his reign, and then he dies. It's inevitable. That is natural order of things."

Maybe, he had plans to take it all in a complete new direction well away from the story line we know, from the moment he came back on board. Who knows where the journey will take us …

Tiwaz

ChestbursterMember528 XPMay-26-2017 6:31 AM

The scene in the book doesn't necessarily contradict the movie.

The sequence is just missing. However, in the movie David says something like "... I've found it ... I've created it...", in that particular order. At least that's what some members stated. I've only seen the german version so far.

Of course he could be lying. But David usually lies through omission rather than faking things. When Walter confronted him he straight out admitted that he bombed the Engineers.

Eine Theorie die nicht auf Etwas solidem basiert ist für gewöhnlich nur Geschwätz.

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