Close
Sign in with your E-Mail & Password
Alien Discussion Forums
What if David is working for the Engineers?

What if David is working for the Engineers?

3,181 Views19 RepliesAdd A Reply
Forum Topic

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-13-2017 12:05 AM

I guess there is one way this franchise can steer its course in a less predictable direction. As far as I know, the planet David and Shaw arrive in is not confirmed to be "Paradise" or the Engineers' homeworld. The inhabitants of this planet can very well be some less advanced relatives of the engineers and maybe they are due to extermination in the same way humanity is. David has been perfecting his skills on how to operate the engineers' spaceships which must have communication channels. What if the engineers looked inside David and found out he is a sentient artificial intelligence, a singularity, and recruited him in exchange of some kind of reward. As we saw in the planet from Prometheus, they had their share of the black goo and maybe they cannot take the risk to manipulate it anymore. But David can. I can see a few potential holes in this theory, but maybe they can be worked out.

19 Responses to What if David is working for the Engineers?

BigDave

DeaconMember10189 XPMay-13-2017 12:54 AM

This in part is what i wondered and hoped for.

The Covenant had to imply some meaning... and i thought the body in his lab from the trailers was a Engineer, and it looked in good condition and certainly not dead for nearly 10 years, then the Plasticized Engineer also... surely its not from one of the Burnt Engineer Bodies.

This lead me to wonder if the Juggernaught had a Engineer or TWO in Cryo-sleep...  And David makes a Covenant with them... but then he goes back on this.

I also thought the Scene of Destruction as a Past Event of maybe Punishment and David arrives to find this but there are a few Engineers left or other beings who did this to the Engineers and David makes a Covenant with them ... before he screws them.

Maybe in either of those above Covenant pacts offering Shaw in return, as i always wondered if Females are something these Engineers are interested in... because they Lost their Females or need for them or had them taken away from them... i wondered if the Disaster Scene was when these beings lost their Females.

Which resulted in other means to create but when cloned themselves they could not create Females and so the Sacrificial Method had the Agenda to eventually lead to Females.

This would connect to Biblical Accounts like Genesis 6:4 when the Sons of God (Angels) had slept with the Daughters of Man to produce Giants...

It would also answer why the Engineer seemed interested in Shaw, and the alternative scenes where he he attacked her but not in a direct way to kill her... his attack in that scene was much like Davids antics.... (spoiler but not gone into detail).

This fitted with the Fallen Angels that Ridley refered to the Engineers as, it fitted with Ridleys comments some time ago, about you had One Guy who was Handsome went to all the Parties, got all the Girls.... then another not so Handsome guy who stayed at home being boring..

This seemed to add up to Ridleys even earlier comment about how he always felt the Fallen Angels in Paradise Lost had all the fun and most interesting part of that Milton Epic...

All this points to a different route they was originally taking?

Before they decided the Fans want Aliens so lets give them F-ing Aliens...

But now we can ponder.... did Ridleys comments about the Guy who get the girls and the one who stays at home... was this reference to David and Walter?

 

 

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-13-2017 1:04 AM

BigDave So do you think that those "Paradise Lost" parallels are supposed to be just a metaphor? And what about what Fassbender said regarding the movie raising the question of what happens or where we go when we die? where in Alien Covenant did you see a reference to that?

BigDave

DeaconMember10189 XPMay-13-2017 1:16 AM

But alas .... these things i was being pushed towards during the run up to Alien Covenant... turned out to be incorrect... Sadly.

However their is scope to see the Engineers for sure... if FOX feel the pressure that Fans want to see them again, i think they could introduce them.... the movie is not set in Stone to eradicate them from the Franchise..

What about the Scorpionaught Docking Station... it hovers, and David was not on it and so is it unmanned?  Why would they need a Docking Ship as we did see the Hanger open up to allow the Juggernaught to land there...

We dont know how the Juggernaught crashed...

Those beings in Alien Covenant do not look like Engineers, not the Sacrificial and LV-223 ones who could be shown as either above those beings or Clones created by them...

The Scorpionaught ship thus could have a few beings on them, you see this whole Movie looked to me like the Movie Aeon Flux as far as those beings being kept within that City for a Reason.

And the Relical in that movie maybe being similar to the Scorpionaught...

So like Aeon Flux....  it has the Relical that contains all the DNA to Clone the Humans kept only in that City (last on Earth) that has the Keeper on-board.

Its not impossible for them to explore the Scorpion docking craft, as similar a Ship that Watches over these beings... that has a Engineer or Elder or a few..

Once David starts the Bombardment, then this ship could be explained as then doing something to damage the Juggernaught and have it crash.... and then release something that Neutralizes the infected beings to turn them into the Burned Corpses.

The Scorpion ship then departs to head to another place where those Superior beings AKA Big Head Room (Elders) come from..

This makes sense as the Engineers Ships in Prometheus we can clearly see their Navigation system has other Galaxies so they must be able to travel beyond our Galaxy.

This would also allow us to bring Paradise into context with the Biblical and Paradise Lost explanation.

*The Cradle of Human Civilization, where Mankind was created. (The Garden of Eden)

*Paradise was/is not Heaven or where God came from.

*Paradise is not where the Angels come from.

*Paradise is Guarded/watched by Cherubim Angels.

Twist that to the Franchise.... and this means Paradise is not where the LV-223/Sacrificial Engineers came from but where they was tasked at Watching over Creation.

It also means its not where the Engineers Creators are from... and so these ideas are where i would take the Franchise... its a way to bring them back in... and ultimately have one of these Elder beings end up trying to prevent David with his Agenda, and take the Eggs away.... and Nuking LV-223 but doing so cause a Tear in Space where the Elder ends up bring thrown back hundreds if not more years back in time and crash on LV-426

This allows the route Ridley is going but also allows to explain the Space Jockey size and Ancient event.

This Post is how i would take the Franchise now... but its a case of would FOX do this?

IF RIDLEY SCOT IS WATCHING... and likes this idea ^^^  i could knock up a 10-20 page draft on it ;)

 

 

 

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

DeaconMember10189 XPMay-13-2017 1:19 AM

I dont really recall word for word what David says, and so i am not so sure if that is mentioned... it only loosely touches upon such themes... very very loosely.

And only in the sense, that implies David and Synthetics are Immortal and Superior to Mankind (also assume aimed to Engineers too) and so this is why he feels Humanoids are a Failed and Dying Race.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

S1m0n

OvomorphMember87 XPMay-13-2017 1:24 AM

The big question is how did the ship crash ? When i watched the film he stated to walter everything was an accident. 

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-13-2017 1:26 AM

BigDave ".... and then release something that Neutralizes the infected beings to turn them into the Burned Corpses."

So you mean if not neutralized the payload would have turn them into monsters?

Well that is why I'm saying maybe the Engineers are directing David, maybe certain canisters would burn the corpses while other canisters would cause the vegetation to mutate.

BigDave

DeaconMember10189 XPMay-13-2017 1:35 AM

You see Alien Covenant has a few very interesting things..

The Hanger that opens up is surrounded by Giant Statues that look like the Offering Buddha Statues.

The Hall of Heads in Alien Covenant look like the Prometheus Engineers...  The Hanger in Alien Covenant and those statues look like they are holding the Sacrificial Cups seen in Prometheus.

We see Prometheus shows us the Tear Drop Ship departs leaving a Engineer behind to Sacrifice himself...  This could apply to the whole purpose of that Hanger with the Offering Statues.

Prometheus set up Sacrifice as a broad theme...

I would ponder and its what i thought before seeing the movie, that what if Paradise is not the Engineers Homeworld... it is a place that Humanoids was created from...

A Place that the Elders visited to take Sacrifices for what ever reason.. maybe to Seed Worlds?

The Engineers started to Rebel against this purpose, and so Mankind or Earlier Version was created to replace those Engineers.  This explains those beings on Paradise.

The Engineers are kicked out of Paradise, and they end up on LV-223 and then they begin to either interfere with Mankind and cast dominion over us... or they take some of those beings from Paradise with them... to then have beings these Engineers can rule over as GODS....

This gets found out by the Elders, who then pursue to destroy those Engineers... Resulting in Punishment onto them, that gives us the Prometheus Angle and the Mural

This back fires as the LV-223 Engineers using the Sacrificial Goo, Re-weaponize the Organism sent to punish them into the Black Goo and attempt to use it on the Engineer Elders home world (not Paradise).

We dont have to cover all this in detail...

Then the Engineers have Humans on Earth rebel against them, but these Engineers having been Punished that creates something they then Worship because it allows those Engineers to be able to Give Birth....  These Engineers then decide as Mankind has Rebelled against them and are offending them...these Engineers now having via Punishment found and experimented on this Punishment to create the Deacon Mural

They now value it as Perfect and decide to use its DNA instead of Engineers to Re-seed Earth and Evolve us into likeness to their new Favored Creations.

These ideas are basically what my intentions for Prometheus 2 was and they can apply to the Franchise now, if FOX decide to say look at my last few Posts on this Topic.

This would also explain this..

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

S1m0n

OvomorphMember87 XPMay-13-2017 1:36 AM

No david explaines the goo basically destroys DNA/destroys it in its current form, if manipulated correctly it could alter and mutate DNA.

It was not the vegetation that mutated but the wildlife and bugs. When David was experimenting he created like a mosquito type bug which then went on to mutate others etc.

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-13-2017 1:40 AM

S1m0n really? but then what is the plant like thing that releases the spores?

BigDave

DeaconMember10189 XPMay-13-2017 1:41 AM

Yeah sorry for going off topic...

As the topic is David in collusion with the Engineers and i have to say this looks like being NO... But thats not to say it cant be explored.

@joylitt

I am not sure you have seen Alien Covenant yet? so i dont want to spoil things... but indeed its not explained really...  David just says the Pathogen reacts in various ways, and that it does not effect non Organic Matter.

This is a Plot Hole however...

As there appears to be no Birds, no Animals left... so we can assume the Bombardment has infected the Environment and killed all Life... but it has not infected Plants...  The Spores are a thing to ponder though..

However if we remember Spores are a type of Fungi and they are thus more related to other Organic Life than Plants...

 

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-13-2017 1:45 AM

BigDave no wonder why Ridley was interested in the Milton poem. And to think Alex Proyas wanted to make it into a movie. It seems the project is shelved now. But he did manage to make the atrocious Gods of Egypt instead!

S1m0n

OvomorphMember87 XPMay-13-2017 1:46 AM

joylitt

I think this was an early attempt at mutation of insects or a byproduct of what david was trying to do but this is my theory only.

BigDave has some good points of view too, unfortunately the film just does not explain a lot to us and leaves us with more questions.

 

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-13-2017 1:47 AM

Yes I was going to say that. There are many animals that look like plants.

BigDave

DeaconMember10189 XPMay-13-2017 1:50 AM

The only way it can be explained... is that the Urns have something that happens to them as they are being Weaponized for Deployment...

So that they are then primed and then explode and release the Black Goo that has a different effect...  The way i can look at it would be a NUKE...

A Nuke will destroy a large area, and burn everything within a area, with the outer area would suffer Radioactive Contamination instead.

However if you instead take a Nuke and mess about with the Radioactive Material that the Nuke uses, then you would get Radioactive contamination...

Maybe the Black Goo is similar and that when messing with the stuff it has a effect seen in Prometheus, but when its Primed and used as intended they cause a chain reaction that explodes and causes a different effect.

The beings on Paradise/Planet 4 appear to going through similar to what the Sacrificial Engineer was only on a smaller scale, they are coughing up Black Stuff (but then Engineer Blood is Black) We can see their skin is starting to melt away, and even some their bodies are mutating out of shape and some even limbs are falling apart/breaking.

But these could all be done by similar to the effects of a Nuke...

The Proposal i made earlier with the Scorpion Ship maybe doing something that Fries those beings thus preventing the Outbreak is something that could be explored... it certainly would answer how the Black Goo worked differently and how the Juggernaut crashed and the Scorpion Docking Ship is no where to be seen.

But then the Nuke Analogy in this post can also explain how the Black Goo acted differently.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Babylonxeno

FacehuggerMember167 XPMay-13-2017 1:56 AM

I think david is working for them or is acting as their legacy, like a son carrying on the fathers goals. Like the deal with his father, weyland.

i think he is in league with them, has their help in the bombing in exchange for shaws biological material, which could be used to create xenos. This all takes place between prometheus and covenant. Not enough there for a movie though. Ill read the book.

In AC david seems to respect the engineers still, he is doing what they do, so he cant say hes better. He does seem to want to eliminate humans from exploring space, which is similar to the engineer plan.

BigDave

DeaconMember10189 XPMay-13-2017 1:58 AM

@S1m0n

Indeed it does.... i think if we look at how i interpreted the Sacrificial and Black Goo, then we can see where the experiments are coming from.

Sacrificial Goo + Wolf = broken down Goo/Mutagen that when passed onto a Human would make a Werewolf for example.

Take Warewolf + Sacrificial Goo then result infects say a Bird then we could have say a smaller Flying Werewolf Bird Hybrid. 

Take Werewolf Bird Hybrid + Sacrificial Goo and results infects a Reptile then we would get Reptile DNA into the new Hybrid... if they wanted more Humanoid Characteristics... then instead of a Reptile... use a Human/Reptile Hybrid.

The only Problem is that the Urns contain the Black Goo, that has Xeno DNA so these experiments would have that as a basis too... but the PLOT HOLE is the Hammerpedes... as it seemed to show once a Organism was infected with the Black Goo and became a Hybrid of itself + Xeno DNA.... it was then not further infected by swimming in the Black Goo.

But in general... i feel the basic idea of this post above, is how David would be conducting experiments... to mix various traits from various Organisms in the aim to create Perfection.

 

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-13-2017 1:58 AM

Maybe its a case of "too much of a good thing". Only a little cup of it is needed to seed Earth (assuming it is the same substance). Here we are talking about a payload.

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-13-2017 2:01 AM

Babylonxeno did you already watch the movie?

joylitt

NeomorphMember1541 XPMay-13-2017 2:02 AM

BigDave Are you sure the planet where the Covenant arrives is called Paradise?

Add A Reply
Log in to Post
Enter Your E-Mail
Enter Your Password

Stay Logged In
Scified Network
Godzilla-Movies.comHosted Community
JurassicWorld3.netHosted Community
Alien-Covenant.comHosted Community
AliensVersus
Predator.net
Hosted Community
Predator4-Movie.comHosted Community
New Alien: Covenant Forum Topics
Highest Forum Ranks Unlocked
BigDave
BigDave
51% To Next Rank
Deacon
dk
dk
82% To Next Rank
Trilobite
Xenotaris
Xenotaris
56% To Next Rank
Praetorian
Thoughts_Dreams
Thoughts_Dreams
77% To Next Rank
Neomorph
MonsterZero
MonsterZero
87% To Next Rank
Xenomorph
Latest Alien Fandom Activity
Get this Prometheus sweater!
Alien Sweater

Alien: Covenant is a sequel to 2012's Prometheus as well as a prequel to 1979's ALIEN. Alien fans looking to know more about Alien: Covenant should check back often. Alien-Covenant.com is an information resource for film enthusiasts looking to learn more about the upcoming blockbuster Alien: Covenant. Providing the latest official and accurate information on Alien: Covenant, this website contains links to every set video, viral video, commercial, trailer, poster, movie still and screenshot available. This site is an extension of the Alien & Predator Fandom on Scified - a central hub for fans of Alien and Prometheus looking to stay up-to-date on the latest news. Images used are property of their respective owners. Alien: Covenant, Prometheus and its associated names, logos and images are property of 20th Century Fox and are in no way owned by Scified and its related entities. This is a fan-created website for the purpose of informing and exciting fans for Alien: Covenant's release. If you have any questions about this site, its content or the Scified Network in general, feel free to contact Scified directly.

Scified is an entertainment media network covering the latest news on the most popular, upcoming science fiction movies, games and television. All content is property of Scified.com unless otherwise stated. Images and names of content we promote, discuss, review or report are property of their respective owners. Scified is independantly owned and operated by a team of dedicated sci-fi movie fans, who strive to provide the best information and community experience for other like-minded sci-fi movie enthusiasts.

© 2021 Scified.com