(SPOILERS) The Massive Plot Hole at the End Of Alien Cov15,668 Views19 RepliesAdd A Reply
I saw Alien Covenant today and it's a great movie. A master class in Sci-Fi horror.
But.....There is only one thing that deflated me a little. (Spoiler Alert).
The film constructed a timeline and a series of events that now makes it impossible for the original derelict craft from the first Alien to exist. David constructed and perfected the final incarnation of the xenomorph virtually at the end of Alien Covenant. He had killed every engineer by using the bio weapons a full ten years before that, to the extent that there was nobody left to impregnate, until the covenant showed up.
Under this time line its impossible for the derelict discovered by the Nostromo to exist - with a hold full of eggs (containing the final xeno) and with the massive figure of the space jockey at the helm (much bigger than any human.) - it doesnt work. A massive plot piece linking Alien Covenant to Alien is missing.
Relax Scott knows what he is doing. He will link it, and there will be the derilect ship.
I really hope an Engineer shows up to rip David's head off again!!
Trust me, the derelict will be piloted by David, he will be space jockey and the eggs will be de colonists of the Covenant...
David didnt create the Xeno - i think he attempted to perfect it. In Prometheus - the wall mural depicts the Alien, as well as Face Huggers
there's still 2 movies to come before things 'catch up' to ALIEN
IN SPACE THERE IS NO WARNING
You are assuming that there exist no other engineers except on that planet. Why? We already met our first engineer on a planetoid with a weapons facility. Are you saying that was the only facility? Or that the such an advanced race as the engineers wouldn't have inhabited other planets? This conclusion seems hastey. There could easily be other planets with engineer cities, there could easily be other places with weapons facilities that house sleeping engineers, and there could easily be active Juggernauts with engineers flying around in space. Many possibilities.
In the actual movie, that mural did not show the part with the facehuggers. Also it depicted something that could have been a xeno, a neo, or a even human mutated into a neo-like creature.
The creature in that mural does NOT look EXACTLY like a xenomorph. So why waste time assuming it is when for all we know, the engineers actually worshiped the neomorph?
My take on the Engineers is they have a Caste society, likely genetic based. There is one Caste who does space travel and the like, with access to higher levels of technology than the possible Caste we see in Covenant, who are restricted in what levels of technology they may use and have no access to spaceflight aside from service given by the other Caste.
This would explain why they were all so amazed to see a Juggernaut arriving.
It also explains physical differences as seen in the Engineers between the two movies.
There's more than likely a good many colonies the Engineers have across the Galaxy and beyond, as in one shot of the orrery in Prometheus the Juggernaut's navigational system show's other Galaxies as possible destination choices.
IN SPACE THERE IS NO WARNING
Hmmm...you all make good points. I had assumed that this was the final film that linked up to the original Alien, but perhaps it isnt. I hear talk about another movie already. For the record i think this was a fantastic movie...i would put it in the top 3 of the franchise (and considering Alien & Aliens are the other two thats high praise. On a personal note Im a kiwi and i live in New Zealand not far from the filming. To see that **** go down in such familiar surroundings was unnerving, but also pretty damn cool - As far as I saw there was no Cg needed. It looks exactly like fiordland does on a Winters day.
Interesting to hear. I was actually wondering if they modified the appearance with CG. I envy you living in a place like that.
No need to sound the alarm bells yet. I think there will be a link in the next movie. Scott was saying in an interview that a script was being written at this very moment. And he was ready to start filming in 14 months.
@ Glenn R, Yeah, Fiordland is a beautiful place, Milford sounds is fantastic. I'm from around that way originally too. I think the only CG going on was to edit out the tourist areas.
I don't think David will be the Pilot but i do agree with the egg theory.
Viddy well, little brother. Viddy well.
Is it possible that the Space Jockey is part of a set of Engineers that marvelled at Davids perfection and construction of the final incarnation of the Xenomorph(as the OP states) and views these eggs as a more efficient weapon, much better than any creature they had seen come from a host previously and so they then decide to accomplish their mission to wipe out mankind on Earth using this weapon, before then beginning a new seeding process on Earth?.
Isnt it a part of the 'Alien' story somewhere that the Space Jockey had been to LV-1201 before it set down on LV-426?. What if a certain set of Engineers began further breeding and tweaking the Xenomorphs on LV-1201, or if not LV-1201 then somewhere similar before loading up the Cargo hold on the derelict for finally completing their mission of wiping out humans.
Cue the link to Alien, where the Engineer suffered from some 'chest pain' and had to put down on LV-426.
It does certainly seem that the Engineers aren't going to just forget that mission to clear Earth of mankind. It seems a high priority for them, what with humans creating Androids like David and claiming they are now creating "life".
@pulserifle187. Nah there would be no need to edit out any signs of tourists. That whole area is just massive unpopulated wilderness. No signs of humans. Its the same as it was thousands of years ago. I guess that's why they used New Zealand. That scene where they go into the dense bush and step on the spores - thats what dense NZ rainforest is really like - It closes around you, there are no animals, only birds -its eerie - if things turn to **** and you cant get out, nobody will ever find you, you will just die surrounded by beauty and loneliness.
(Oh and I should point out that the photo above isnt from the movie - its actually just a random shot of native forest here - just to illustrate that it really does look like that)
OK, so maybe I'm thick or something, but how come the Predator race were getting aliens out of eggs about 4000 years before David (Alien v Predator) if, as suggested, he perfected the egg birth method in Covenant?
i would suggest u to forget the AVP series...
But as someone mentioned before, there were creatures like xenomorph and facehugger and such on the engineer's wall in Prometheus, so maybe it's not the first time they appear and actually were existed long before.
If David created the Xeno, then how does that explain the mural in Prometheus? I would say David has recreated it based on his knowlege of the Engineers. Don't forget that David is completely off his **** with stolen technology, and a psychopathic plaigerist.
I felt similarly deflated but some of the points raised on here are (reassuringly) valid, especially the mural facehuggers.
Regarding the ship's 'hold' - didn't Ridley retcon this to be an Engineer temple that the ship crashed into? Either way, I really hope the twist'll be that David didn't originally create the Xeno.
Cheers for restoring my faith, people (still gutted about Shaw though)!
I agree. I was gutted about Shaw too. Her death was perhaps the most twisted and evil of any character in the franchise. Her kindness to David repaid by being turned into a lab experiment of corrupted flesh. There were some characters particularly in Prometheus however that practically had 'kill me' tattooed on their forehead such as.....Holloway the designated 'douche bag' ....Millburn the 'poke a stick into a hornets nest' retard.....Fifield the lazer-ball dog whisperer. They all deserved to die for being such ridiculous stereotypes.
I will look at other replies and comment to them tomorrow..
For now i will add my TWO Cents...
The Derelict will not be impossible... it will just have be shown that the event happens within up to say 17 years or less before Alien and connected to where David goes next..... i bet LV-223
The Colonists indeed could become those Eggs.... but this could be a red herring.... they could still have David being the one who Re-Engineers the Xenomorphs but Ridleys comments seem to indicate that the Eggs on the Derelict would not exist if not for David.... yes Prometheus showed a Egg but this shot was so quick that we are expected to not really see it much and it can be passed of as a oversight...
The Space Jockey being David i feel is a bit flawed unless they decide to show us Synthetics can be infected... But then why did the Face Huggers not go after David?
The Space Jockey will likely be a Human, maybe Daniels... or even a Synthetic like Walter if they have parts to rebuild another and indeed Walter models are Synthetic Constructs. Then again they could show us David is actually Walter only with Davids Soul/Mind.
To be honest its a Mess, they have really Fudged the Franchise in a way now... but there is hope..
Alien Eggs could have existed before but hosting a different type of Organism.
They can bring in a Engineer or Elder who comes in to prevent David having access to LV-223 and in the end a Engineer/Elder takes Davids Cargo Ship off him and sets off some Nuke or similar to destroy LV-223... Then he crashes on LV-426
maybe the event that causes the destruction of LV-223 causes a tear in time and space and forces the Derelict through it that sends it many years in the past and crashes on LV-426
Much like how some worry the LHC experiments could lead to destruction via opening up another Dimension, a Tear in Space to another Time or even a Black Hole... because trying to Re-create the Big Bang is a very bad idea.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017