Is This Walter Being Briefed About The Lost Prometheus Mission?7,523 Views25 RepliesAdd A Reply
We know the events of A L I E N: C OV E N A N T take place ten years after the lost PROMETHEUS mission. What remains unknown as yet, is exactly when the Covenant left Earth. Enough time to gather much intel no doubt.
The planet in the beautiful, panoramic piano scene could be LV-223. Hence I wonder, is this Walter being shown images and briefed about the lost Prometheus mission, prior to leaving on the Covenant?
The man in the black suit could be a Weyland-Yutani exec or another David-Walter android, if indeed the AI are now running W-Y as many of us have speculated!
This could be David or Walter. Some have speculated that it is David and Peter Weyland in a flashback scene, which is perfectly possible. However, as yet, we can't be certain of that.
What are your thoughts about this? Please feel free to share them below!
The reason I am doubtful about it being David and Sir Peter Weyland in a flashback scene, is that it would surely be impossible for Weyland to have images of LV-223 prior to the Prometheus mission!
I wouldn't think it's PW talking about the Covenant mission. Weyland was on the Prometheus ship and died there so that would be impossible. I think it's David and Weyland discussing Gods and Humans being able to create life and the questions about why we are here. Peter is probably telling him than in a lot of ways he(David) is so much more capable than a human.
My two cents...
The planet at the beginning of Prometheus is earth. This is confirmed in the deleted scenes in the blu-ray release of Prometheus. It says "Engineers touch down on primordial EARTH to seed planet with life." So I think that this scene is Weyland and David talking with scenery from earth.
Dont over think it people
I'm with the flashback scene scenario
simple fact weyland will be in this movie and he died in the last one...
And yet, Ridley Scott has stated that the opening scene from Prometheus, could be any planet, at any time. This scene was representational of the ongoing efforts of the Engineers to bring life to planets.
From what I understand he has said it both ways.
If we look at the lake and mountains... then it does look like a LV-223 if it had more life to it... LV-223 appeared to be a bit more baron so could be after something evolves on LV-223 (remember Fire and Stone the world evolved into having life and plant life).... or LV-223 looked like that prior to maybe a Weapons Test (Black Goo testing).
This is possible..... but then it also looks like some shots of Paradise, and it could be that....
But then the FACTS are LV-223 was shot on Earth... in Iceland.... Paradise was shot in New Zealand and the Primordial World in Prometheus was also shot on Earth.
So what we have really is that Earth does not have to be the only Earth-like World that could have lakes and green mountains in the Galaxy...
So the image in the trailer is very open to debate.... which is a good thing, like Prometheus had vague clues that can allow is all to have our own interpretations... just as the Nativity painting in the background could too...
As far as Prometheus Scene at the begining... i think the image used in that AC trailer is from the same location myself.... the Scene in Prometheus was intended as Earth... but then Ridley did say that it could be any world.. not to say its another... but that indeed there are many Earth like Worlds the Engineers have seeded life on/
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
Looking at this scene.....
I think when looking at the Nativity Painting too and the Enchanted Nature Boy Song..... i think this scene is a David/Walter moment...
There was a rumour Guy Pearce would be in the movie in a Flash Back... more details came that it would be after David was brought online (booted up) and a younger Weyland discussed creation and life and death with David and then David begins to play The Entry of the Gods Into Valhalla
On a Piano..... This rumor was never confirmed and while IMDB added Pearce to the cast... this is no concrete sign of if this was true.....
However seeing the Trailer... and there being a Piano... surely means the rumor must not be just coincidence...
And so my Bet is this is a Earlier David model... and a Younger Peter Weyland and after Weyland talks to David the reaction we see is Davids reaction to those questions... and his response then is to play the Piano..
I would say with 90% certainty this is the case...
Looking at the character with Fassbender.. if its Peter Weyland then indeed its a Peter Weyland around the age of he is now 49.... the Character with Fassbender has the same Hair Color and Style as the Weyland 2023 Ted Talk...
Guy Pearce who is 49 could pass for 35-45 year old with ease, especially with some make up and lighting.. like a Brad Pitt Age has been kind on Guy Pearce.
Therefore if we assume (minus the Miracles of Cryo-sleep or related therapy to make one look younger). Peter Weyland in this shot is Aged 35-50 years old... this would in the Alien Time line point to the years... 2025 to 2040
If we look at the Timeline as far as David models between those years or around... here is what we get..
David 1 January 7, 2025 (Weyland is 34 years old).
Weyland manufactures the first advanced android prototype model of its kind. He is affectionately called David, a name Sir Peter Weyland had initially reserved for his own human son.
David 2 January 1, 2028 (Weyland is 37 years old).
Weyland makes significant adjustments to the David android prototype, facilitating David’s first interaction with humans. This initial meeting is very promising.
David 3 June 30, 2035 (Weyland is 44 years old).
After android regulations are lifted, the third generation David is deployed internally in order to test human acceptance of cybernetics individuals. Results are encouraging.
David 4 April 1, 2042 (Weyland is 51 years old).
David 4 becomes the first commercially available model of the David series. He is eventually expected to improve work-flow and efficiency at offices and homes across the world.
I would say that this scene is a flash back from between 2025 to 2042
I would say further that this seems to be a David 1-3 with maybe a 3-4 fitting with how old Guy Pearce could get away with.... but then it would not be beyond the realms of him playing a Weyland interacting with a David 1 or 2 thus playing a 34-38 year old Man at the age of 49....
Guy Pearce played a 32 year old for the TED Talk 2023... when he was actually 44 years old...
so my MONEY is on this being in the year 2025 or 2028 and a David 1 or 2 model.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
If Weyland discusses to David creation, and life and death and Weylands ambitions and reasons for creating David, basically similar to how Weyland had talked to the Engineer before David got his head ripped off..
If Davids response was to play The Entry of the Gods Into Valhalla
In this answer is a response and warning... that playing God can lead to consequences that the desire of Power can lead to destruction... Prometheus and the Theft of the Fire.. leads to this.... Adam and Eve and the Forbidden Fruit and in the Das Rheingold Musical Tale..... the pursuit of a Powerful Ring that allows those who possess it to be the Gods now... carries a Curse...
This is just a theory... as we dont know what exactly Weyland says to David... but if he touches upon some of the things Weyland did at the Ted Talk and to that Engineer.. where Weyland thinks he is now a God himself because he has created life.... and possesses many Technological Advancements and Pursuits...
The playing of Das Rheingold The Entry of the Gods Into Valhalla
Would be in a way a answer that gives warning to the eventual downfall of Weylands Ambition to play God...
A similar theme the Engineers may also have fallen into...
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
It did cross my mind that this could be an earlier David model and a younger Weyland.
I hadn't heard about that piano rumour Dave, that is very interesting and changes things somewhat. I was hoping you would happen upon this topic and share your wisdom!
Yes that makes perfect sense in terms of both Weyland's downfall/death and that of the Engineers.
It could all add up to a powerful and amazing scene, with the visuals, music and ominous foreshadowing!
A few weeks ago.. i discussed David where i said what if David 1 who is Weylands Child ... well how can David 8 be the son Weyland never had? When there would be thousands of Davids....
Which got me to suggest that maybe David 1 is David and when Weyland upgrades his Models.. his personal David has his memories transferred to the next Prototype..
This essentially grants David the wish that Weyland wanted.. immortality.... but also as Davids conscious and memories are transferred model to model... by the time of David 8 he would have a wealth of experiences and knowledge and memories.. he would indeed be Weylands Son...
He would possess a SOUL
This theory i think holds some weight... as what the point of the Scene in this Topic.. if David 8 or Walter have no recollection of it?
I also think Walter is a Synthetic Construct like Elden from Fire and Stone.... and so Walter is closer to the Real Boy that Pinocchio David maybe wants to be...
This would raise a interesting Dynamic and if these ideas are not used then its a big Cop out for the Writers and maybe they should just get me on board for the next one lol
Walter is a Synthetic Construct much closer to a Real Enchanted Boy.... but David has more free-will and a Life Time of Memories from inception of David 1...
Then David has more of a Soul.... if David could transfer his Soul/Memories to Walters Body then David would indeed get his Pinocchio wish..
But there is a Potential Price... a Synthetic Construct can be infected with the Black Goo... its likely they could also be Face Hugged? Thats not to say either would be explored..
Just if they took the route that David transfers his soul to Walter... and Davids playing with the Fire... he would ultimately suffer a Prometheon Fate....
A Ultimate Hubris..... David gets what he wants... but it could potentially come at a cost...
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
I believe there is a flashback scene of a discussion between david and weyland. I doubt very much it would be walter, walter may not have even met weyland as he is possibly the upto date version of david and if walter had been available, being the upgrade, wouldn't it be logical weyland wouldv sent the more modern android? I believe its in weylands home on earth and that's just a window with a view. looks like david is seated and weyland standing. the posture of the man standing doesn't seem to be Michael fassbender but a bit more guy pearce in nature, IMO
We also can't rule out Walter and a Weyland hologram briefing him before the Covenant ships out.
Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!
myrddin, when would weyland have time to send this message? first scenes with him on Prometheus is he is, we r led to believe, just up and being cleaned. the mission at this point isn't a success or failure so nothing to report yet. i would say walter has never met weyland as if walter was available at the time Prometheus was being planned then surely weyland wouldv taken walter instead of david, walter being the updated version. IMO this is a flashback to a younger weyland talking to david, david being seated and oh look, dark hair. would give the audience theyr answer as to how david could impersonate walter at some stage of the film as it looks like dark is his natural colour
Weyland could have recorded a holographic message literally any time after he found out about LV-223 and LV-426. There were years between when Shaw found the last cave paintings and the actual ship out date for Prometheus.
Would it also be a huge leap to infer that Weyland tried to achieve singularity on some level and this is a holographic representation, or synthetic version of Mr. Weyland?
Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!
Just gonna drop in and add that despite the Blu-Ray reference, the planet at the start of Promeheus could be any planet. And what's more, i have a theory which i will be posting on the front page which suggests the planet at the beginnin of Prometheus is actually the setting for Alien: Covenant. ;) imagine the twist! I'll elaborate more in my post, though.
As for this scene - I believe it is a flashback between David and Weyland however David is supposed to have Blonde hair. Not that he can't dye it brown later on. I always thought David changed his hair color to mimic (his name escapes me at the moment) from that film he watches at the beginning of Prometheus. He mimics Human behavior and seems to he trying very hard to understand what it is like to be human.
Of course, the Weyland viral videos inteoducing David would discount this as they featured Davids with blonde hair. So we know it wasn't personal choice but a production quality.
Given the above, it would not be far fetched to assume the scene referenced here is not the flashback scene with David and Weyland, but a different executive at Weyland-Yutani briefing Walter of his impending mission and what he is to expect if he encounters David. Look at the facial expressions. They are of wonderment and curiosity and a slight touch of concern. David alwayd looked cynical in a way. I feel like this is Walter, not David.
I am in purdah (no spoilers for me) until 1900.5.18.17. But I love exchanging with you so here are my thoughts.
If you freeze frame Prometheus at 2.11 with the teardrop ship passing over the lake toward the sacrificial point you will immediately recognise the scene the two characters are looking at. The topography is identical. The little chink on the mountain right side in front view, the sweep of the mountains down to the Lake on the left and the range behind that central mountain point.
David dressed in white, like the christ child in Piero della Francesco's Painting hung on the wall, is at the beginning of his journey. both the christ child and David are going to go on an exceptional journey. This is the beginning of his journey and Weyland as Davids surrogate father will be reflecting on and with his creation.
At some point David we are told plays on the piano the Entry of the Gods to Valhalla which strikes me as a piece of genius. There are suggestions that David discusses how in playing the music David discusses the tenants of the story in that the Gods are disappointed with their creations and yet the Gods do not consider or recognise they are suffering the same flaws.
For me this has John Logan all over it threading, making connections and rich in symbolism.
The tantalising element, isn't it all tantalising, is are they looking out from one of Weyland's Homes on Earth (a little to contrived) or are they look at a visual message that Weyland has received. If the latter then this maybe primordial Paradise before the Sacrificial Engineer arrived to give to the planet what he is. Released from the hierarchy, now grown into the perfect catalyser he passes into the life blood of the planet. What we may have seen at the beginning of Prometheus is the planting of seeds which will grow into a garden, the garden of eden. However the Engineers not content with their Paradise (Adam and Eve) began experimenting and flew to LV223 to begin their own sub creation and like Peter Weyland were seeking immortality and a release from bondage, out of which emerged the mutagen and its appalling consequences. Mankind was caught in their hubristic experiments and despite only being a "superior species" they began tampering with our development intending eventually to redact it. Was the mutagen just unfortunate or as I have said before punishment a booby trap.
How ironic that one of man kinds creation will enter Paradise and bring before them the consequences of their fall and wreck havoc .
This scene is important in another way it tells us the big ideas the thought provoking elements of the story have remained intact. It is simply the consequences of the story will be offered in a more direct and communicable way and one that the general audience can relate to more easily.
Most important of all David has so much to tell us and let us know how much of what we have glanced at and interpreted is correct.
The more I consider that these two are looking out on a scene from the planet that the Teardrop ship blesses with the Engineers sacrifice like the painting, like the choice of music this seems to be positioning how the Prometheus will be to quote from the recent interview with Wayne Haag "drawn into" the narrative chosen.
In the sameway that IF David and the mutagenised catalyser is responsible for Paradise Lost it has huge implications for the story so to does the implication that the Teardrop ship scene is more than just a seeding, it is the creation of Paradise by the hierarchy into which the Engineers come.
This would strengthen the sense of hierarchy from the creator right through to David and brings one back to the conversation between David and Weyland.
On a more practical level if David is the straight line into the Covenant story to confuse the global audience by offering the other robot in the first scene of the film when the idea is to bring context doesn't make sense to me. It makes sense to re establish David and then place Walter, who Michael has said is to use my phrase more the compliant employee, in the midst of the Covenant Crew introduction.
It's most definitely Peter Weyland, Guy Pearce body language says it all, the way he tilts his head is something he does in a lot of films.
The planet doesn't look like LV-223 imo based on where Prometheus took place where everything was barren as opposed to the green landscape on that picture. Who knows.
I think the Android there is David accompanied by a young Weyland. Walter is a newer model who is developed much later if I'm not mistaken.
Wild guess is that in that scene, David discusses life's profound questions with Peter Weyland.
I think the way the android childishly gazes up to Peter in the trailer indicates that he is curious and wants to learn. Maybe Peter started to peak David's interest (trigger him) here with questions about a "soul" or "gods/creators"
Just a theory of course
I think that its some kind of orientation, like an explanatory dream sequence for new artificial humans. Upon first being "initialized" or whatever, they are introduced to conciousness/ the world, by a "visit" with their "father," a young Weyland. Kind of a "Welcome to the World" routine.
That makes a lot of sense, too.
Safe? Of course he isn't safe, but he's good!
The erotic moment we see in the end of alien covenant a alien king spawning...and in the next he mates with the queen and originates the xenomorph.
Or walter chest opening and spawning a queen.
Either way bring it
In a draft for "Prometheus," there were several scenes where David, while on LV-223, met on a yacht with a young Peter Weyland. In other words, it was some type of dream or computer program that allowed Weyland to be around age 40 while he was near death and elderly on Prometheus. This plot device allowed David to be a narrator, who explained to Weyland (And us) the Engineers history and the origin of the Alien.
it could be walter chris ur right, but IMO, for the course of the films I don't think walter survives and david is a much more interesting character. if im right, there doesn't seem much sense in putting walter in what appears to be such a significant scene. I think it is a flashback of david who has very recently been brought online and having an indepth discussion with a younger weyland as this would help show david in a more child like state and then we see how he has evolved/grown up to the david he is today and give an insight into why he is doing what hes doing. it can be revieled at anytime what walter has been told about david but this seems to be quite a significant scene and I don't think it would be wasted on something walter could be told at anytime, even on the ship. the company might not even know david has survived the Prometheus mission