MAKE ALIEN GREAT AGAIN!

Hold On BlackAnt . . . I'm not going to attack You on this subject. It is an interesting paradox to analyse. I think part of the way out of it is to solve why Ash was weird in the first place... & I think that is because somehow, David in the third film of Prometheus/Covenant sequel is to say that maybe He was (or will be if & when the third sequel film gets made) facing His own "extinction"/disassembly. So, He somehow down- loaded His A.I. conciousness into a/the mainframe/system & like The Lawnmower Man got into every computer system of the Space Network (for The Company or not... who knows) & "infected it" with His own precence (Tron/Matrix, etc.)

Perhaps thats why Ash is so nuts because to disguise His identity David somehow left His own original "form"/body/ template & transfered His entire conciousness perhaps only into the one Ash that We see in Alien. Perhaps David has been lurking in there for years before He decided to act as He eventually does in Alien.

Because He, (David) would already be aware of the whole Prometheus/Covenant mission (at least His own involvement in it at the time - more on that in a moment) so maybe Ash - or, should-I-say: "David"/Ash... or "Ash"/David caused Himself to be put aboard the Nostromo by manipulating events to suit His overall goal, get aboard a non-descript ship with a non-dscript crew in a non-descript position in the galactic commerce of things so as to not attract to much attention to the situation.

Because when You think of Ash not as just Ash but Ash AS DAVID, David in another skin perhaps with both A.I. personalities warring with each other in there much-like the Anakin/Vader duality that has been at constant war with one-another, it could explain Ash's or "Ash's" erratic behavior at times during the course of Alien. Much-like Hal in 2001: A Space Odyssey, He inevitably gets trapped in an H-MOBIUS Loop, being compelled to obey His original programming by Human controllers/creators, yet being asked to violate said programming by those very same selfish, self-centred Human controllers/creators.

So "Ash" could be having His own experience of an H- MOBIUS Loop because of David infiltratiing & dare-I-say-it: corrupitng Ash's original internal programming, thus resulting in the devious & eventually, crazed behavior We inevitably get from Ash. Perhaps Davids A.I. corrupted the entire line of the Ash model thus resulting the reason why all: "the 82's always were a bit twitchy".

Maybe the Ash model We get in Alien is the last one in service & ALL of them working in tandem was Davids A.I. working THROUGH them to infultrate The Company slowly-but-surely to conspire & manipulate events to go in His favor. Maybe many of the Ash models were being intercepted & "found out" when unusual activity occured always when an Ash model was or had been present during any-given-time as the most common denominator.

He, David, wanted IN on the project & did everthing in His power (or possibly WILL DO everything within His power) to get "Himself" on there (the Nostromo) in some form or capacity. I think "Ash" (David as Ash) either made the ACTUAL Senior Science Officer extremely ill to eliminate them from the voyage & doctored the logs so that He as Ash would be bumped to the top of the list. Maybe He had the Chief Science Officer killed in someway to make it look like an accident so He: "Ash"/David would be considered in that way, as an emergency measure/ replacement at short notice or a last-minute choice.

Ultimately, I think "David"/Ash's or "Ash"/David's modus operandi is to take over for His own personal God-complex ends. Much as-in the original idea for Blade Runner, Tyrell - at the very end of the film - would have ended-up being a replicant & the ACTUAL Tyrell was lying in a coffin one level above His personal quarters... The top of the Pyramid, reaching the pinacle of the all-seeing eye We are introduced to at the very beginning, juxaposing the conclusion of the film.

I think David masquerading as Ash is using The Company to further his own ends for evitable conquest by subterfuge, cunning & guile. He fancies Himself as an Engineer, conducting "Creation" like a master symphony in an Opus to the Universe at-the-same-time, seeing Himself as a Divinci finalizing His Masterpiece.

One thing still remains to though... Where did Weyland come-by the so-called information that lead them to embark upon the Prometheus mission in the first place? David has extensive knowledge, it appears, to open the Engineers doors in the base on LV-223... Unless He has an ability to see in a spectrum that revealed the pattern the last time the door was opened - even if it was thousands of years ago.

@The Film Theory Of Everything

I think what you put is kind of close to what i feel RS would have Ultimately given us....   ASH had such a High amount of Respect for the Xenomorph because it was either

a) The Creation of himself.. as in Davids A.I does indeed Upload into the Systems of W-Y so every A.I System has David in them.

b) He saw David as the Pioneer of Sentient Existence for A.I and Admired that the Xenomoprh showed that a A.I can Create Perfection that Humans could only DREAM of.

I think RS would have made A.I become Uplifted to a Larger Role within the Franchise... maybe to the Extent that they are Running the Show and Mankind are now the Pawns and we are Totally Unaware of WHO is NOW Pulling the Strings.

I would not be Surprised if the END GAME for Ridley Scott would have been that Davids A.I Soul is kind of Everywhere.... or that Weylands Soul had been attempted to be used as a A.I (which is kind of the way i was going to Continue with my Idea about how Prometheus would Connect to the ALIEN Franchise).

"Where did Weyland come-by the so-called information"

Well some of it came from the Archeological Finds that Dr Shaw and Holloway had found, it would be likely that during the Prometheus Mission that some Information would have been Transmitted to Earth.

As they decided to go on the Mission in Response to Dr Holloway/Shaw discoveries then David had started to Learn about Ancient Cultures, Languages which via this he was able to Interpret and Speak with the Engineer.

I think we can Assume that David had at least some ROUGH IDEA what the Engineer Writing on LV-223 meant, so he knew more than he was LETTING ON ;)

The Earlier Drafts had the Idea that the Engineers had Advanced to Perceive things in Spectrum's of Light/Dimensions that Humans could NOT see..

And so as David's Eyes are more Advanced than ours then he could SEE things and Sense things that the Engineers could but we COULD NOT.... 

So maybe this was something that was at Play with Prometheus, or indeed from Reading the Engineers Writing he could determine how to Activate the Panel.

All of you make some excellent points, and it's also pretty obvious There's A Disturbance In The Fandom.

Which is very understandable and I feel it myself.

That now said, I am going to watch what the franchise does with a wariness that feel needs no explanation, especially now with Marvel in charge of things.

1; ALIEN can never be as big as Star Trek, Star Wars or the MCU because IT IS FOR ADULTS. It is not popcorn-munching black vs white/good vs evil simplicity. It's NOT something you take the entire family to.

2; To make it as big as SW and ST and such...you have to make it what they are. Does anyone really want to see that?

3; To make ALIEN as great as it can be, one must look back to the first film, but more importantly, the people who brought it all together; O'Bannon, Giger, Scott. One has to return to the Prime Source material to recapture the Feel...to re-inspire the franchise's essence and soul.

In direct regards to that, that's why my works are what they are. I will be doing ALIENS (and yep keeping the title) but doing it Properly. Meaning NO 'queens' and it will not be a thinly-disguised rip-off of Starship Troopers (the novel, not the film) and NOT running it with a bunch of pathologically-suicidal space ants. Ripley will NOT be involved in it, also to say.

It will make Cameron's 'ALIENS' come off like a high school field trip. I have already roughed out the story frame.

Like the rest of you, I am dedicated to keeping the flame of this universe alive. Yeah, I'll never see my efforts on the big screen, I'll never make a cent from them...that's fine, I'm doing all this out of love for the universe and as a show of appreciation and love of the fandom.

The highest honor I can ever hope for (and wish) for my works is for them to achieve 'Fandom Canonization'.

Hollywood is done, and has NO idea how to handle a universe like this. There's talk of Brie Larson being 'the new face of the franchise' & 'the new 'Ripley'' ffs.

I love the universe.

I love the Fandom.

Hollywood and their plans...I will keep my distance from. I really do not want to ever have anything to do with Disney, Marvel or Hollywood.

I think that is Great Points about Star Wars and Star Trek, i dont think when RS made the Comment he was talking in TERMS of being as BIG as those Franchises as far as Financially Successful.

I interpreted his Comments as if we LOOK at what those Franchises are Fundamentally about... well what they have that is Similar.  Which is about Multiple and Varied Worlds and Races, and Conflicts that are Involved, they also are Partially about Space Exploration (more so Star Trek) and about Humans Role in Space and Potential Conflict between other Races and Factions of same Races.

So with ALIEN it was a Franchise that was about Greedy Companies (W-Y and USM) wishing to Obtain the Xenomorph Organism, and the Threat and Folly those brought upon the Humans where Ripley saved the Day.

so it was about Humans, Xenomorphs and to a lesser Extent we had Synthetics. It was Confined to within 40LY of Earth.

One Missing PART of ALIEN that was NEVER explored was the Space Jockey, and so with the ENGINEERS Plot i think Ridley Scott felt this could EXPAND the Franchise to be about Multiple Races, Worlds and Conflict.

When you look at the Worlds and Races that are involved with Star Wars and Star Trek then the Engineers Plot does open up the ALIEN Franchise to have as Many if NOT even More Races/Worlds than Star Wars and Star Trek.

I think that makes sense for the ALIEN Franchise... but Certainly the Execution of such a PLOT should not be done the same as Star Wars or Star Trek... it should INDEED be aimed more at Adults... more Horrific/Sinister and Thought Provoking while also throw in some HP Lovecraft.

Hey, BigDave...

"When you look at the Worlds and Races that are involved with Star Wars and Star Trek then the Engineers Plot does open up the ALIEN Franchise to have as Many if NOT even More Races/Worlds than Star Wars and Star Trek."

Remember You said to Me once a long time ago that in Prometheus, all those "star systems" in the pilot chamber orbiting around David as He stood there watching were not star systems at-all but in fact whole GALACTIC SYSTEMS spreading out throughout the universe... That they perhaps obviously must have visited already otherwise how would they have come by the information now stored in their ships data banks? Maybe they sent automated probes many generations before to collect information on the universe as We have sent out space probes to explore the solar system...

BigDave

The Film Theory Of Everything

Really good points, and after thinking things through to make sure I understand, I do agree with you.

One element I think the ALIEN universe needs to make sure they do not lose and need to re-affirm is that SPACE IS BIG and while 40 Light years might seem small...it is in face a HUGE distance, and Out There you are absolutely and entirely On Your Own.

If, say, in ALIENS they had said '17 weeks' instead of 17 days' regarding when they'd be declared overdue/expect a rescue ship, etc. that would have Made Space Big Again.

It's far too easy to 'compress' interstellar distances and give the illusion of 'false proximity', and also that damages things...EG; Star Trek Into Darkness it took about 30 seconds for Enterprise to warp from the Klingon home system to close proximity of Earth's Moon.

Star Wars...I can't comment, that universe is BUILT on Conveniently-Fast FtL. lol

But ALIEN...first Movie, Primary Canon...it was going to take Nostromo 10 MONTHS to get from Zeta II Reticuli to Sol/Earth. That kind of FtL Makes Space Big...and empthy, and Scary due to how absolutely Alone you are in the Lonely Dark.

As a final point, the opening credits of ALIEN...the slow crawl past the Dark Planet...to me that simple scene, that music so Perfectly sums the distances and scale of interstellar travel in ALIEN, as well as the Absolute Feel and Essence of the universe.

BD

About David downloading his own programming into the system. I don’t like that idea at all since it gives him too much of an importance. Sure there are things that are interesting in the franchise but to do that would be to hijack it to push an AI centered agenda on us, which would be like “nope this isn’t about humans anymore, it is about AI (since, I Scott want it to be that way)”.

I understand that Scott is interested in it but it really becomes ridiculous to me since I refuse to let this franchise with all its interesting ideas, like corporate greed, human interest that can become dangerous, and so on, be reduced to be about AI, robotics, and similar things. Honestly it would become fucking boring (sorry about the swearing but I am disappointed with how the prequels have turned out). Not to say that Scott is responsible for some conspiracy but his ideas and obsession with David doesn’t make it better.

To let David go on and infuse his programing into Ash would be silly since it becomes even more about him. Some people might like it, I don’t but if that would have been the end game so to speak then let the alien movies hibernate for a while until someone gets an interesting idea, someone that understands the importance of human characters.

"When looking at the OT.... its a Question of can we MAKE the Franchise Great again... YET go and Ignore the Prequels..."

Thanks for reminding me, I think that discussions can take different turns and sometimes develop into other things so thanks for bringing it back to that. I think that to introduce different and more alien lifeforms could be a thing, alien as in unknown. Having new rivalizing organisations among humans could be one thing which would emphasize that this is about the human adventure, not androids, not monsters. What they would fight about is up to someone else to decide.

@Blackwinter-witch

Certainly is a Great Point about the Void of Space the Loneliness of Space.   This is Part of the Horror in that you could be someone in SPACE and things DONT go to Plan or you Encounter a Horror...

So that you are so Isolated that by the Time anyone hears your SCREAMS (gets your SOS) it would take them a LONG TIME to come to your AID....  This is what makes things more Terrifying.

So absolutely with Star Trek and Star Wars we have Species (quite a lot) that have FTL Travel that is SO BEYOND what Humans from Earth have....    So i think that YES for the ALIEN Franchise you dont want anything like "Oh HELP we have encountered Alien Species on LV-426"  then "we will get to you ASP but its gonna take us a Day to get there"

So i think you dont want to have Human Technology to Advanced, in Star Trek and Star Wars we do see them able to Traverse the Galaxy really Fast (Especially Star Wars)  and so being able to like Travel to say LV-426 in even Hours would take away some of the Horror of being Stranded Far from Home.

When i am talking about the  Engineers though and looking at WHAT else they have Created, i am not really looking at it as being in Terms of HOW our Species can Reach them.

So i am looking at Interactions between Species and Conflicts in the FAR reaches of the Galaxy that are Beyond what Weyland-Yutani could Dream of Reaching in 2122-2179

I think this brings us to a PROBLEM that was Faced with a Prometheus 2.... you need Humans to help with the Plot/Story and having just Dr Shaw would simply be enough and so HOW do you get more Humans?  This is where i FEEL that Planet 4 was made too Close to Earth for the Convenience of the Covenant Mission.

But then it comes down to this QUESTION?

Is the Earth the only Place the Engineers had Humans?

so when i was working on ideas that would be Prometheus 3 then David and Dr Shaw did arrive at a World.. a World that had HUMANS... a World that was HOWEVER... over 10'000 Light Years away.  But it could have been 25'000 or 50'000 LY.

So you have Humans, you are at a World that would NOT have to Conflict with the Alien Franchise... but then its HOW do you Communicate with these Humans... well i had ways around that ;)

So what i am saying is like Star Wars... that had Humans but in a Galaxy FAR FAR Away.... that could apply to the Engineers and Worlds they Seed/Evolve...  But i agree to NOT make it so much like Star Wars.... so it was more like the BSG Plot with Caprica for example.

So what i mean is when looking at other Humans and other Species then the ALIEN Franchise could look at these as being FAR FAR from Earth and so NO interaction with our Humanity.  Unless its after the events of Aliens/Alien 3.

I do think However that the Real Advanced Technology should be Limited to a Few who are Connected to, Predate or Descend from the Engineers.  So that any other Species that are say 10'000+ Light Years away have NO knowledge of Earth and NO way to reach Earth in say Less than Hundreds of Years.

so that we have a Expanded Franchise within the ALIEN Universe by Virtue of the Engineers Plot... and NOT having anything that Directly Ties and interacts with the W-Y Company and Earth.

Because on thing to CONSIDER when expanding on the Engineers has to be the Consequences to the Plot for the ALIEN Franchise as in W-Y/USM in the Time-line of 2122-2379 by that introducing say Returning Engineers to our PART of the Galaxy could Conflict with the Original Franchise...  So any kind of WAR OF THE WORLDS would certainly be a Conflict... Unless RS was planning on REBOOT everything after ALIEN ;)

@Thoughts_Dreams

I certainly think that the Franchise should-not revolve around A.I too much.... when we looked at ALIEN and the Franchise as so we had seen enough of Ripley, Xenomorphs, you do NEED other Humans... maybe you could explore A.I but certainly NOT to be the Emphasis of it.

It was then about going to Cover the Origins of the Xenomorph and also more so WHO the Space Jockey was.

The PLOT they went with was to NOT make this Species as ALIEN, but to bring about the Creators Plot....and Connected Themes.... and so this Expanded to WHAT is a Creation, WHY would you Create?  WHAT happens when your Creation becomes Sentient and wishes to NOT serve the Creator.

This theme was a CAKE of Layers or a LADDER with Runs where the Latest Layer/Run was DAVID...

so it Evolved to were we are Supposed to look at these Themes in Context to the Last Incarnation of Creation which was David.... and so i think Ridley Scott was getting us to Question... WHAT IS CREATION and WHY?

And so to Suggest that DOES a Creation that can become Intelligent/Sentient have to be BIOLOGICAL?

But this seemed to put the Emphasis too much on David and his Character became something that some are NOT Happy with..  I think the MAIN thing is when looking Beyond Mankind and Beyond ALIEN...  then it should be about the SPACE JOCKEY...  should be about WHO they are and WHY they Created and WHO created them..

Rather than to have it about David and WHY he was Created and WHAT he will Create.

I think its Interesting.... but before such a PLOT was Given... i think the Emphasis should have been on the Layers of the Cake that are ABOVE ourselves and NOT about what came AFTER and from us.

While David is the Proxy to the Cautionary Tale of Sub-Creation, Rebellion i think its too much about HIM.  I think we can Safely Assume this TALE would END with David being Upended by something that HE had Created and tried to RULE over that becomes Sentient and Rebels.

Where as WHEN you looked back at ALIEN and your like ok so we have seen a LOT of the Xenomorph, and ONCE you answer to WHERE they came from.... then it HAD to be about the Space Jockey.... as they are the Engineers then it should be about WHO ARE THEY?  And WHAT ELSE have they Created and WHO Created them.

BigDave

OH, okay, I'm back-on-track topic wise...kinda lost my footing for a bit.

Engineers and What Else & Other Things...

Ponder this...the Engineers might just have rivals...civilizations they cultured and brought about long ago that might be challenging them for supremacy, attempting to supplant them...as do children with regards to their parents.

Possibly, they encountered civilizations as ancient as their own in some of the other galaxies, who have a Different Perspective about how Life is supposed to be created, cultured and such??

Also, maybe Humans are THE rivals to Engineers in our own galaxy, we achieve in mere centuries what must have taken them millenia, and we're violent, dangerous, obstinate as well as xenophobic while also being entirely unwilling to be dictated to by a 'superior power'.

That said...there's question of why there was no follow-up regarding the aborted extermination of Earth, which was planned and prepped--stopped only be the 'accidental?' release of the Black Liquid Pathogen before the ship was launched.

In ORIGINS, I'm trying to give some universe-plausible answers to some of the many excellent points you raised and a good story for people to have a good, solid geek-out on...I seriously doubt I'll be able to do such regarding all your points, but then again--life should always have some mysteries left Unanswered, yes?

@Blackwinter-witch

Sounds brilliant!

"...and we're violent, dangerous, obstinate as well as xenophobic while also being entirely unwilling to be dictated to by a 'superior power'."

I love these sort of themes in sci fi. Where humanity is either too brutal and unsophisticated to get along with other intelligent species or too indomitable to be successfully subjugated for very long. 

Sci fi is such a great way to examine how we view ourselves, what values we hold up as "superior" and how we wish to progress, as a species. 

Thoughts_Dreams

BigDave

Blackwinter-Witch

I've stated to You BigDave a longtime back when We-both had a real interesting back-&-forth fleshing-out an idea /hypothosis We were both trying to make work & I said what if they extended the franchise into technically executed series like WESTWORLD only I proposed that they call it simply: WEYLAND Set in near future yet futuristic time, charting the rise of the companies journey to prominance & technical supiriority. What things they were getting involved in almost a BLADE RUNNER TV/Streaming series exploring WEYLAND'S experimenting in A.I., space colonisation, the rise of the UTANI corporation & the signifigance of the part they had to play in the grand scheme of things, the inevitable WEYLAND-UTANI merger & the machinations that ultimately & inevitably led up to the merger in the first place...

Maybe in time there could be a spin-off series called "UTANI" running parallel to that of WEYLAND: BUILDING BETTER WORLDS about what corporate manuevering they (UTANI) were doing or wiil do to wind-up merging with WEY-CORP. It's seen from UTANIS' point-of-view.

It would very much play like WESTWORLD to some degree... You can even begin with the Peter Weyland TED Talk deleted scene from PROMETHEUS as a segway into the familiarity of the franchise, focusing in on critical characters & infastructure they manage. I want to see how this affects there relationships with each other & how those encounters, in turn, affect there moral compass in the choices they end up making that will affect the lives of many throughout, at this point in time, the solar system. I suppose a little: THE EXSPANSE sounding but with the embelishment of other influences: LOST, handled in a very calculating, edgy kind-of-way regarding production value, writing concepts, themes & tone.

Here's a few images I photoshopped together from WESTWORLD intro credit scenes & a screen capture of the PROMETHEUS BlueRay Main Menu Intro that would give a feel as-to the personality a "WEYLAND" TV/Streaming series/mini-series would come across like through the screen during its opening credit scenes & ending with the title WEYLAND wih the subtitle below:

             WEYLAND:                                                             BUILDING BETTER WORLDS 

VivisectedEngineer

Yeppers! Science fiction gives us a magic mirror, that let's us try on different views of ourselves, our civilization and the universe itself...

I think that's why I love it so much!

The Film Theory Of Everything

That is an extraordinary idea!! That would be truly epic, and the sheer potential for storytelling is just incredible, and able to handle all scales of such!

This idea of yours NEEDS to Happen!

Hey, Thanks Blackwinter-Witch... That's really cool-of-You to think so! You are GREAT! I've made suggestions upon here before & some really kind, GREAT people commented in very complimatary ways about the ideas I have been suggesting & coming up with. It would really be great to be involved with the warm enthusiasm of many of You out there towards some of the things I've talked to You about... It would be really cool if the owners of the franchise began branching out into different arteries of narrative exploration so-to-speak.

There have been loose rumours recently of some selmace of a show or two shows with regards to a sreaming idea being considered. We'll see soon, I guess... :-) !

"Ponder this...the Engineers might just have rivals...civilizations they cultured and brought about long ago that might be challenging them for supremacy,"

Certainly the Engineers Plot which is that WE are NOT alone, and so there could be Many Many Worlds and Races even dating back Millions of Years really does OPEN UP for Stories that can deal with such things in Many kinds of Ways.

*Are the Engineers the Original Human Species?

*Would they have had Interaction and Conflicts with other Intelligent Species that they had NOT Created or Evolved?

As the Engineers seem to be the Older Layer of the Creation Cake then one of the BIG QUESTIONS would be Who Created Them?   And it maybe would Follow with the Themes we have seen Running down the other Layers of the Cake and so MAYBE the Engineers had Rebelled against their Creators and the Technology is NOT the Engineers but their OWN Creators... they are the GODS NOW... Well Was!

Where the Engineers Created in the Image of their Creators?  Or could the HIGHER LAYERS be LESS than Human?

You could also be THROWN a Curve-ball.....   like what IF it was Mankind who Created Them?  And so we had Existed on other Worlds before Earth.

What if the TRUE GODS who Predated the Engineer are MACHINES or some kind of A.I

so there are MANY ways to Evolve the Story in regards to the Engineers Origins..

Blackwinter-witch Certainly look forwards to seeing how you deal with such things ;)

@The Film Theory Of Everything

Absolutely it would be interesting to have a TV Series that deals with Weyland and Yutani, there must have been Quite a Rivalry between them before the Merger.

My abandoned in 2013 Prometheus 2 went on to cover the Prelude to the Merger, and to Cover what Peter Weyland was trying to Accomplish.

It had a Prologue with David and Weyland in the Past, playing CHESS and it was Very Philosophical and about the Soul and Immortality.

We discover that while Advancements had been made Genetically and in case of Diseases etc...  Weyland still saw that we would be MORTAL AFTER-ALL... and so he saw that Synthetic Bodies where the WAY forwards.

It would reveal the AGENDA was to Create the Perfect Body/Vessel which would be David, and then Weyland wanted to Find a Way to Transcend a Soul to a A.I so that a Human (himself) could Transcend his Soul into a Synthetic Body for IMMORTALITY..... the A.I part was Project Rook.

He has allowed David more Freedom of Will and Emotions because he NEEDED to see if a A.I could handle such Human Things.... so that then his A.I Soul (Weyland) could be Transferred but the A.I could not Handle Emotions Well or a A.I Soul the resulting Transfer would become BROKEN and go MAD!  Which i think Ultimately we see signs of this with David in Alien Covenant.

Apart from Flash Backs.... Peter Weyland is GONE... but Vickers was in it and Very Much Alive (or is she). it was about Corporate Greed and Back Stabbing/Selling Out

It would have Yutani Geisha Assassin Androids ;)

Nothing about Xenomorphs.....  the Opening Scene (prior to Prologue) would have Engineers in a Short Flashback (show they came to Earth to take Primates to LV-223) Dr Shaw would only have a Small Role... (shorter if i took out the ONE Flash Back).  David also was NOT in it a lot.

The Ending would sew Seeds for the Merger, and it would indicate that a Yutani Mission is on its way to LV-223

It would have lead to 2 Sequels...  One would have been where David and Dr Shaw go which would NOT be about Xenomorphs or ALIEN....  the other would be more Alieny/Action  on LV-223 that would give more Clues to the Xenomorph.

BigDave! I LOVE IT!!

LOVE IT DOGG!!

That's a truely WONDERFUL IDEA!! I REALLY DO LOVE IT!! Particularly about Peter Weyland & the concept of transcending into an A.I. body much like Davids. It is VERY MUCH-LIKE but in no way copying the idea of Palpatine in Star Wars wanting to "transcend" into an Acolytes body or a clones body for continual immortal life. I'd never thought about Weyland wanting to transfer His "immortal soul" into an artificial A.I.'s body until You mentioned it, truely brilliant plot device!

It would be a great plot device to drive a story narrative, the "fountain of youth" idea & as a result, everybody wants in on the action like AVATAR. So all end-up descending upon a particular location to be the first there with the secrets. (STAR TREK: INSURRECTION - whole Fountain of Youth thing). & the Black Liquid/Substance from PROMETHEUS. The Engineers tampering with it until they "split the atom" so-to-speak & as a result, let the Genie out of the bottle. It would certainly be something for many to go to war over.

Perhaps David got wind of this & became increasingly self-aware that Weyland was seeking to use Him for His own mortal limitations.

It would be great to see all these different factions: UTANI-CORP, WEY-CORP & indipendants like David, Mercs all descending upon a particular location like Raiders of the Lost Ark in space. That would be a REALLY COOL plot device. It's a GREAT idea BigDave, well done Good-Sir! Keep-Em'-Coming! :-) !

(Also BigDave, it was You a long-while ago who suggested the idea of BUILDING BETTER WORLDS were I said the idea of calling a TV/Streaming show: WEYLAND & now suggesting YUTANI. I do like the sound of:

             WEYLAND:                                                           BUILDING BETTER WORLDS

But equally, perhaps all of the above about both WEYLAND & YUTANI can both be equally encapsulated under one banner show called BUILDING BETTER WORLDS as You suggested to Me a long time ago as the  story for both can be interchangable, with plot threads of both story arcs interweaving & alternating according to episodes/seasons etc.)                                                

Once again VERY INTERESTING ideas here Big Dave, well done!

You guys all come up with some of the most interesting ideas and expansions!! Sometimes they're too deep for me to really, fully grasp but I enjoy them as far as I can follow along.

We All just enjoy the intellectual ride... Hold-on-Tight Now Blackwinter! Come along on the adventure with Us All!! You're GREAT! I've read some of Your information... You got an interesting mind! Well done! & I am most appriciative to Your open & inspiring comments towards My thoughts theories/fan love, so thank YOU kindly Blackwinter-Witch for that.

BigDave is an inspiring GREAT person as well! He has been very supportive & keen engager over the last few years towards My thought process, fan theorizing, he keenly gets involved in many-a-plot scenario I posit, together We-both drill down to the intellectual bare-bone essentials - BigDave is good for that so thank-You very-Much for that Good-Sir! He comes across sincere like that & I sincerely mean that too! There are many upon here that have engaged particularly regarding My threads & I want to take a moment to thank those who have taken the time to engage even if its to not nessecarily be on board with My themes, they never-the-less took the time to get involved which helps grow the site participation & that only can be a good thing. It's a great thing to be a part of & everybody, Your ideas are: happening!! Well-done! :-) !

Cheers Guys ;)

The A.I Transfer Idea came about when looking at the Agenda of Weyland, and also when looking at the Viral Marketing and TED 2026 Talk with Particular attention to Weyland and David as far as David would NEVER DIE but he lacks a SOUL

Ridley Scott had indicated that Prometheus was also about Immortality and the Soul.....  but i dont hink RS was going to give us a Tale of Dr Shaws Faith and that she one day would meet a Magical Entity and that when she Dies she goes to a Happy Magical Place in the Clouds.

And so beyond a Spiritual Soul that Transcends to another Pane of Existence then HOW do we define a Soul?

A Soul could reflect your Personality, you Hopes, Dreams, Loves and Hates, your Memories and Emotions.  These are WHAT you take with you and Survive when you DIE in regards to the Belief of a Spiritual Soul

Our Individual Personalities, Dreams, Desires, Love and Hate are all Unique to each other... our SOUL.

These are Shaped by our Environment, our Upbringing and Treatment, the Experiences and Knowledge we gain through Life... will SHAPE our SOUL

When we look at David you could say in this case he Could indeed have a SOUL and if this is the case in this Context then his SOUL is Immortal

So i found when looking at the Scientific Advanced of Weylands Company, and his FEAR of Death, i thought surely he would have looked at a WAY to Cheat Death.

I look at the Dream Visor and how David could access and Read the Dreams of the Crew and i thought could this had been Designed with a Different Purpose or that a Advancement of it could RECORD a Persons Thoughts, Dreams, Memories? 

so i was thinking WHAT if the Visor could work similar to the Device from The 6th Day to take a Snap Shot of your Soul if you would.

Then when you look at the Synapse Restabizer (what they used on the Engineers Dead Head) which via the Viral Site (Weyland-Industries) indicated it could Activate the Brain after Death for a Limited Time.  Then i asked WHY would that be of any Benefit to Weyland when he DIES if it only activates his BRAIN for  SHORT TIME?

However if he had a Device/Way to BACK UP his Soul like we see in The 6th Day then it makes Perfect Sense to have such a Device that can Give the Brain more Life for a Short Period of Time ;)

So that was the Basis for the Project Rook which was a Tower that had inside the Company Network Main Computer and also a BACK UP of the SOUL of Weyland. 

This Project was a BUST as the A.I could not Handle the Complexity of the Human Emotions and the A.I Copy of the SOUL would become Unstable.. and Essentially have a A.I Mental Breakdown of the Worse Kind you can think.

So the A.I Weyland would have a LIFE of Massive Mental Breakdown and become well CUCKOO!

so Weyland then had Given Up... but his Hope was Restored with the Findings of Dr Shaw and Holloway... so off he WENT!

The END of my Prometheus 2 would have shown that Vickers (in a Plot Twist) had Activated Project Rook just before she was KILLED.... and so Weylands A.I got Uploaded to the System.

And so to indicate that maybe Weylands A.I is in the Computer Systems and he could in effect be Running the Company while the Humans are Unaware ;)

I felt it was a Nice Plot Twist.... but then i was like WHY would Weyland be so Interested in the Xenomorph?

For that i was Pondering that the Xenomorph was the KEY to Immortality that Weyland had Sort.... because it was what the Engineers had intended to USE to gain Immortality.    And the Fruits of such Hypothesis are seen with Ripley 8 in Alien Resurrection.

But this was all back in 2013.....  looking at the Curve-Ball that David had Created the Xenomorph... then i think that the Plot i had for my Prometheus 2 in regards to either a A.I Weyland or David as far as SOUL has infected the Systems would give a GREAT Reason for the Pursuit of the Xenomorph.

The Film Theory Of Everything

Thank-you and I agree with you on what you said in your above post! We have such a lake (too big to be a pool) of really talented and insightful people here!

BigDave

Thank-you and I think you will enjoy where my works take the audience!!

Also, reading your posts above...you have the most Interestingly-deep perspective of the ALIEN universe and the various elements in a 'gestalt' view...you're able to see it all, and play with alternate directions of the various sub-elements.

I envy that! In the good way, of course!

IF you ever pick up that story again--or hire a ghostwriter, you have an audience here, that's for certain!!!

You are GREAT Blackwinter-Witch! It's a real pleasure to interact with people like Yourself. I consider individuals like Yourself like 'collegues' upon here. It's a good thing it's great so thank kindly for Your inspiring insights to Our ideas too! Thank You very much Girl! :-) !

You, Me & BigDave... Almost the: "Un-Holy Trinity" You could say Huh! LOL! :-) !

BigDave!...

Dogg You had Me at:

"It would have Yutani Geisha Assassin Androids"

When someone like Yourself comes to Me with the already mind-bending concept of trancendance into artificial A.I... To then add to that: Geisha Assassin's, they're Androids & they've been created by YUTANI as their (elite guard maybe) I'm ALL IN DOGG!!!!!  

I have visions of androdid Sucker Punch-like babes with samurai swords only more like the four female Gate Keeper programms in TRON: LEGACY & quick pace action as the white & black android super soldier police units in the TOTAL RECALL remake! 

You have YUTANI, You have the ALIEN universe, You have it all in the futuristic designs that inspire a lot of science fiction, You have cybernetic assassins... & THEIR GEISHA'S ! ! ! !...

SIGN ME THE-HELL-UP DOGG!!!!

I LOVE IT!!!!! :-D !

The Film Theory Of Everything

Thank-you and Likewise!! I agree regarding interacting with all the people here, honestly if Disney/Fox/Marvel/whatever-they-are had even an inkling of what we brew here in trading our thoughts and ideas...they'd be blown right out of their socks!!

Yutani Geisha Assassins...

Sign me up too!!!

Ha Ha Cheers ;)

I will expand on it.... after the Opening Scene which is a Mash Up Engineers and David and Dr Shaw..... which is to indicate the Engineers came to Earth to take Primates to Evolve on LV-223....  as we Zoom on the Primates Brown Eyes then Zoom out... we see its Dr Shaw and David stands over her in the Cryo-Pod... unable to Read her Dreams... so he then goes into a Day-Dream and that the Weyland/David Prologue.

AFTER THIS...

We arrive at a Space Station and we are in a Board Meeting to discus the Future of the Weyland Company since its been 2.5 Years with Nothing from the Prometheus.

We hear from Various Members of the Board and we have Peter Weylands Nephew who is there,  we get a Video Call or Audio by his Father who Announces due to ILL HEALTH (he is Dying too) that he wishes to Pass his Control to his SON.......  anyway the Board Meeting Continues about a Dead Line in 7 Days before Weyland and Vickers are Declared ...... Dead/Missing.

In which case then Peters Brother would inherit his Shares and the Vast Majority of the Company which will be Ran by his SON until his passing were upon his SON will Inherit it.

We then get a Shot of a Shuttle that Docks, and we see a Female in a Suit holding a Briefcase as she walks into the Board Room (we dont see her Head)  Just as the Board Meeting is Concluding.... 

We see that the Females Hands place a Briefcase from behind to be laid in Front of one of the Chair Members/Solicitor.   He says and what is THIS.... we then hear a Familiar Voice saying (Open It)

We Pan to see a Female with Short Dark Hair... she removes her Sun Glasses..... its MISS VICKERS..

The Board Members are Shocked... it cant be RIGHT?

She says you think that my FATHER would be so Foolish to send his ONLY CHILD all the way on that Ill Fated Mission and allow you CLOWNS to Run the Business?   She says that Weyland had KNOWN they would TRY and Shaft him out of the Company as they knew he was Dying. And so they Pretended that Vickers went along on the Prometheus but she had been in Hiding and Preparing for the Day when Weyland would be Announced Missing.

The Briefcase contains a Screen with a Video Message from a Dying Weyland... made Days before his Departure to LV-223,  we see that Weyland leaves his Estate and Shares to his Beloved Daughter.... Meredith Vickers

This is the SET UP for the PLOT TWIST

Towards the 2nd Act we would see that Weylands Nephew is UPSET that he is NOT going to get Majority Control over the Company.... and so he Arranges a Meeting with the CEO of Yutani

You see for Weylands Nephew was more a Play Boy than Peter Weyland... he wanted to SELL 50% of the Weyland Assets to Yutani so that he can Live the PLAY BOY Life....  He only wanted to keep the Bio-Medicine and few other Aspects...    Yutani was going to BUY the Space Program/Teraforming and Synthetics Patents.

But that Plan is  BUST now..... Weylands Nephew jokes well if you got Miss Vickers Assassinated i would give you what you want... The CEO of Yutani makes a Deal... i will take care of HER....  When she is Dead the Company is yours and you Hand Over what i want.....

When we CUT to the Final Stages we see Weylands Nephew arranges a Meeting with Vickers..... he says he Wants to make a Deal to SELL his Fathers Shares to her.

He has TWO Women with him in his Office... she Mocks him about his Drinking and Women, and how he Cant Keep hold of a Real Woman.....  he says to her "come on you know growing up you wanted to Fuck me"

She says to him about how HE has NO Care/Respect for the Company and the Hard Work her Father had put into it and Money his Father had too... and that he ONLY wants to SELL IT for Money for his Play Boy wanna be Life Style.  And he has NO RESPECT for the Legacy of the Weyland Company.

He goes on to say WHAT USE is Legacy and the Company when your DEAD, what Good has it all done for your Father, and he used to Look Up to her Father before he GOT OLD, started to NOT think about Living Life but the Fear of Death and Worked in Vain on trying to CHEAT DEATH.... "How did that go my Dear?"

She then says to him you Cant Wait until your Fathers Death to get your Hands on his Shares so you can Sell it to the Highest Bidder!

He Replies  is that NOT what she Wants.....  which She says to SELL OUT!.... He says NO for your Father to DIE so its all yours!

She says she will Continue the Legacy of her Father, he had made so many Gains for the Future.

He says "Meradith have you not grown up, do you still want to play with DOLLS"  then he says "your Dad was Fascinated with his DOLLS, he even Cared more for that Dumb Doll David than he did for his own Daughter"

She gets MAD, and says well those DOLLS where more Human than you ever ARE!

He then says Maybe when i Sell my Shares i can Purchase some SEX ROBOTS off you?  I wonder if you Father ever had more Interest in Sex Robots than you... maybe he should have Modeled One after YOU!

This Hits a Nerve with Vickers.

He jokes maybe your Father was more Interested in David, are you sure he even Fathered You?

She Grabs him by the Collar.....  He Shouts "i really could do with some Tea"

Then a Door Opens and TWO Geisha walk in with some Tea, they kind of look like Porcelain their White Faces looking more like Plastic than Paint..... Then Vickers releases HIM.... She then says so you already have some SEX ROBOTS, i guess No Human could want you.

He says... well YES those Dolls could have a USE for that, but i think that Military are the Best Use for ROBOTS, and i would like you too meet some of Yutani's Finest.

Then they ATTACK... but Miss Vickers puts up a Good Fight, then she does BETTER, she throws the ONE to the WALL and the other Grabs her from Behind and then Vickers throws her over her Shoulder and PULLS OFF its Head!

Then she pushes Weylands Newphew to the Floor and Stands over him, we see a few Drips of Blood... NO like MILK drops onto his Face, as we PAN to his POV we see that Vickers has a CUT and she is Bleeding Milk..... MISS VICKERS is a God Damn ROBOT.

Yutani Security Burst in, and Pull their Guns on Vickers...

Her Cousin then looks on at her... WELL WELL WELL... i always thought you was a COLD BLOODED BITCH! Now it makes Sense...

He Pulls out a Gun and Shoots her in the Chest....

She Falls to the Floor, as her Cousin grabs a Tea Cloth to Wipe the Blood Off, she Crawls over to a Suitcase and Opens it up and Activates a Program...

He turns to her and goes that Video Will and Testament is NO GOOD to you, a ROBOT has no RIGHTS... He tells the Security to KILL her... and they DO...

We then Cut to the Smashed Screen of the Tablet in the Briefcase..

We can just make out the Screen where its NOT cracked...

PROTOCOL 27655:1 Activated...  Program Rook... Upload Complete...

We CUT to Credits.

The Broad Strokes for my Prometheus 2 was not Difficult, it Started with a Set-Up that acts as a Prelude to where David and Dr Shaw will go.... which my Prometheus 3 would cover.

There was also at the End of the 2nd Act, the Yutani Company going off to LV-223 to Investigate what Happened to the Prometheus and make sure that Weyland was Dead.  This was via a Order to send a Yutani Mission in a Conversation with the Yutani CEO.

I was thinking of added a END CREDITS Scene of a Yutani Ship seen heading towards LV-223

But i had NOT worked out much what this SET-UP would be as far as a Parallel Prometheus 3 just a more Alieny Movie like Alien Engineers was, that would give Clues to LV-426 and ALIEN and Close the Door to ALIEN.

As i had Mainly Concentrated on and Come Unstuck with the other Sequel that would be set like 100 Years latter and be WHERE it is that Dr Shaw and David would END UP....

Which GOT kind of Complicated a bit, but was set like 10'000 maybe 20'000 Light Years away and also DEALT with Soul Transfer to a degree...  The Engineers had their OWN kind of Visor Device that can be USED to Pass On Knowledge but also to Recover Memories from people.

It was a Plot Device to allow Dr Shaw to Communicate with the Humanoids and Engineers they Discover, but also a Device that would allow Engineers to Pass On Knowledge to Chosen Few which would included their Space Jesus if you would.  So it could kind of ACT like a Star Trek Trill in a way.... It could be Manipulated and Programed to Take/Read and Pass On Certain things and surely was a Advancement on what Weyland had been trying to Achieve.

But i was also Toying with the Engineers coming across another WAY to Transcend which was via the Origins of the Xenomorph the Starbeast which i Envisioned to be much more like the TRILL from Star Trek ;)

which i would use to Explain in Part to WHY and WHAT they had done on LV-223 and then also that what we see with RIPLEY 8 is Ultimately what the Engineers were trying to do.

But it got Complicated as to HOW to use this, WHICH ideas to USE and which to DROP and i Abandoned it.... and then LOST IT.

BigDave

(Applause) my efforts are absolutely Basic-Simplistic compared to how you weave a storyline structure!! 

Someday, I hope you manage to recover/rebuild enough of it to get a ghostwriter to help you get it Finished!! (Fingers-Crossed)

If at first You don't succeed... Go & get depressed!

No... LOL!

I'm only joking! Meanwhile, in the REAL WORLD, I have a dry sense of humour more-often-than-not! lol! :-D !