In the Deleted Scene/ long battle at the end of the film, when the Engineer shows interest in the video they were trying to send out, might this point to them seeing it prior to the meeting with Weyland?
which deleted scene you are talking about? There is a scene at the end where Shaw has a longer struggle against the big guy, where he comes in into the life pod and observes the books, chandelier and the video of a girl playing violin. Is that what you are talking about?
Indeed this is the only Scene i can think that Nathan was on about.
To me this Scene shows that the Engineer had taken a very keen interest in the Advancements that Mankind had made after the Engineers Abandoned us (after the Failed Plan to Eradicate us).
The Deleted Scenes do give a different outlook to our Engineer, including the longer scene of him and David talking. Which can maybe push us to ponder could this Engineer have Sabotaged the Mission?
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
BigDave, the scene which most likely you are talking about ( this one, right?, btw turn on the captions https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5j1Y8EGWnc ) where the woken up fellow has somewhat longer conversation with David only shows that he was extremely disturbed by being woken up by the expedition team.
Shaw was saying that the bombs were made on LV-223, and it was meant for humans. And she wonders what was that they screwed-up so wrong. Then there is a sequence of Weyland asking for more life and the big fellow telling through David why Weyland wanted more life. If you watch and read the captions, the big fellow supposedly says : "Why does he want more life? What makes this man so great as to ask such a thing?" Before I go on and address the conjecture that there might have been sort of sabotage, a couple of observations wrt to the clip.
If we are to believe that captions are legit and come from the legit source then, this is not the first time engineers are asked for more life by "men". Because if you look at his reply to Weyland he asks what makes Weyland such a great man. Apparently, according to this giant, "great" men from the past have asked for more life. What a contrast, isn't it? While those folks on Planet 4 are probably grown to seed life by sacrifice, some "great" humans on earth wanted more life instead - completely opposite to what those Planet 4 folks where doing? How about a conjecture that all ancient human civilizations, with all the differences among them all wanted one thing in common between all of them - the great kings wanted to live forever, just like Weyland. I have no doubt the engineers are tired to death by their children who are supposedly seeded and given life in their own image and share identical DNA want more life and do not want to sacrifice. This must be blood boiling for the big boys, huh? How come they sacrifice their lives and this sort of shit comes up and says "I want more life, father"....lol.
Of course then comes Weyland telling that he alone has built David from scratch, which might be revealing to the big fellow as Weyland is someone who might have been seeded by engineers, with his predecessors given some sort of technology, like fire and some other rudimentary means, yet here he is standing tall in front of his master pointing finger at his master claiming "he built that thing from nothing" that he is a god, a creator and deserves to live forever. Weyland should have said at the end of his soliloquy : "Ignorance is bliss". Something we know engineers don't do - live forever themselves. I can see why the big boy might have had enough with these "great men".
However, what surprised me a bit more is that for the engineer, David, who is an android and is completely different to humans, which no doubt became apparent to the big boy once he dismembered his head from his body, did not present any interest. The engineer might be familiar with human bodies, but the fact that David is not one bit interesting for him tells me that He, the big boy must have seen likes of David numerous times in the past. Perhaps at one point they had such chatter boxes and bundles of awesomeness as David in the past?
As for the other deleted scene, big boy's attention is captured by the typography of the books, the lighting from the fixture in the pod and the music/video from the screen. Perhaps David would tell him - "Bravo, you have symphonies in you brother" had he more time with the big boy. So supposedly a synthetic android is not interesting to the big boy, yet some typefaces and melodies are interesting. Something is not right here. Either the typefaces and the music were extremely similar to what he heard before or he is a bit of a act first and think later type of guy, which is entirely possible, if he was some sort of military guy who needed to terminate the source of threat first and deal with the evidence later on.
In either case, I can't really see how he, the big guy was either the party who sabotaged or was on the receiving end of the sabotage. If he was sabotaging, then, it must be the other fellow engineers who are dead who were sabotaged and he is alive. Supposedly, now that they are dead, he can go and wipe the humans. Ironically though it is humans who came and woke him up. Had the Prometheus crew had proper risk assessment done, and employed proper protocols and engagement rules in place that engineer perhaps would have had a bit more trouble killing them all. Just imagine that they brought with them a bit of tools, heavy machinery, a few RPGs and perhaps some lasers with big ass chains :) "If he bleeds we can kill it".
If he was sabotaged instead, which is possible, then he missed his alarm clock by a lot(2000+ years). He wakes up and his first hunch is to go in a hurry and wipe the earth. So he realizes that he must have lost a lot of time and he must be fast. Then the sabotage is done by someone who released the pathogen on his fellows. Probably he was supposed to be woken up from cryosleep and bomb the Earth when his ship arrived at the vicinity of Earth, but apparently something went south.
On meta-level, in both of the cases the grand picture doesn't quite add up to what Ridley was telling behind the cameras - that there was a breakout and something went wrong. His whole point was that by chance a disease has stopped big boys in the tracks and that is it. Has there been a sabotage arc, Prometheus would warrant a prequel for itself - which was not what RS was doing right? Because, otherwise, suddenly, a short story which was supposed to be a prequel to the Alien becomes this drama about engineers which needs at least one or more prequels of its own. This was never planned, hence, it has been cut - the stories which open up possibilities need to be cut otherwise people will complain that the movie was chopped up and lacked focus.
In any case, telling self consistent, short yet meaningful stories, with detailed and supposedly worked out internal logic is tough, impossible really. Especially if you planned it to be just a prequel with run time shorter than 3 hours.
Indeed the thing to remember here is that the Plot has been changing constantly.... the Plot we have NOW is not exactly the same as the the first concept.. in terms of the Engineers.
There are a number of Scenes that have NEVER been shown for Prometheus, the Scene of the Engineer being knocked out of his Chair and then running across LV-223 to the Life-Boat, the Books Scene where the Engineer picks up a Book and looks at it.. A extended Hologram Engineer Scene (after David activates the Juggernaught). But there are stills from these Scenes on the Internet and other resources.
The Engineer Speaks Scene is maybe also cut down (even in the deleted scene), Fassbender had to Learn many Pages of Dialect and Ian Whyte also had to learn a lot, but his contribution was dubbed over with some Gibberish that just sounded more Menacing. We also have not seen the FULL Elders Scene, the Actor who played the Sacrificial Engineer (Daniel Twiss) said he had to learn a few lines of Alien Dialect in a Conversation with a Elder. So there was a TWO-WAY Dialog during that Scene that we have not seen but we only have one Extract of what the Elder Says.
The thing is they chop and change scenes to suit the changes of direction or how much they intend to reveal.
The Full Engineer Speaks and Last Battle Scenes would have given us a different insight into the Engineer rather than being a angry being intend on Destroying Mankind.
I was drawn after seeing those scenes that the Engineer was intrigued by seeing the Humans, it seemed he was very interested in the sight of a Female and her Questions. (The Plot prior to Prometheus Release was these Engineers had lost the ability to Procreate). It seemed to me though that the Engineer Witnessed the Selfish Actions of Weyland and how he saw ONLY what he wanted as being important and the context of what Weyland Wanted.. the Engineer realized that INDEED Mankind are a Cruel and Selfish Race, despite a few who could prove otherwise, the risk of allowing Mankind to Live and especially NOW they can Travel the Stars and Create a Life-Form that can use their Engineer Technology as a MASSIVE threat to their kind.
So the Engineer had no Choice but to Carry on the Mission and Eradicate Earth.
It was a while after i had been driven to these conclusion, that i came across these IMAGES
The Surviving Engineers POD was called the Hero Pod and so we could ask HOW was he a Hero?, WHY only he survived?
If we looked at him being ONE who had changed his mind and thought that Mankind Did-not need to be Destroyed and so he then Sabotaged the Mission. This would indeed make him a HERO of sorts to our Savior, it would explain a bit of his reaction and intrigue to Dr Shaw and the things he was interested in the Life-Boat. We could then see that ONCE he discovers Mankind is still Cruel and Selfish and have not changed our ways and NOW they can Travel the Stars and use their Technology (via David) the Engineer had NO choice but to carry on with the Mission, his Brothers were Correct.
I do think this was the intention at the point of Production and Shooting... But things change and this is not the OUTLOOK of our Engineers at the time of the Release of Prometheus. Things further changed with Alien Covenant because it is now indicated those LV-223 Engineers are not the Originals and those Original Planet 4 Engineers are FAR from Immortal only living for 150 years... Also at the time of Prometheus the Xenomorph was NOT a Creation by David.
Another thing i was drawn to after seeing Prometheus that i discussed here many years ago as the Reaction of the Engineer towards David... when he touched David, it seemed to me the Engineer had pity for David and Sympathy but a dislike for Weyland and Ultimately he had to destroy David and Weyland because of the Threat they pose.
I was drawn to ponder back then IF the Engineer and David are similar, Enhanced Beings meant to Serve and so the Engineer had pity for David because David reminds him of what his Purpose was.
I find it interesting with AC the Reveal by RS in comments made, that the Planet 4 Engineers are the Originals... which leads me to think that our Prometheus Engineers are to those Planet 4 beings as Replicants are to Humans, if this is the case then indeed my thoughts on the Engineer and his reaction to David in that he sees David is similar could be close to what RS was going for.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
If sacrifice was a typical part of the Engineers' cultural ritual, why were they shown fleeing in the playback, attempting to escape a fate of sacrifice/ infection?
@BigDave: And if the Engineers on LV-223 are replicant equivalents to the Planet 4 inhabitants, why did the Deacon not come out appearing more mechanoid?
Replicants, in a BR world anyway, are not robots - they are humans, with same organic tissues. That is there are no mechanical parts in them. They are grown in labs rather than in wombs.
As far as accepting your fate goes, perhaps just perhaps, they are not OK with an unidentified UFO coming on them and spraying them with a deadly agent. That is just plain murder. Perhaps they have lived for millions of years, generation after generation, practicing their ways on their terms, where they sacrifice life to seed life, yet here comes a UFO, completely out of blue and does something quite out of the protocol where it just takes their lives for nothing wiping the whole population by spraying some shit in the process.
No, it carried archbishop of Canterbury.
I assume you where asking about the ship on which David arrived at Planet 4.
If you were asking about the life pod which Janek ejected with Vickers just before hitting the ship, then the deacon, that creature that is not quite a xeno is never shown to be carried anywhere.
@BioDegradable: There's a great Giger painting there, his phallus seeking out other planets to penetrate and infect;)
BigDave I think nobody makes movies in such details, at least I have not seen such movies...well unless someone like Kubrik or QT(who tries to work out all the small details in dialogs) or even RS in Bladerunner. I frankly believe that most of the people on boards over-estimate the movie in its attention to details. I came to realize that most movies are plain shit, where they do bare minimum and ask you to suspend your disbelief. There are only a few movies that are very specific and detailed and worked out with watertight scripts. Alien, Prometheus, AC are not such movies. So most of the time people like you(and me and others) give too much credit trying to deal with the ambiguity, which is actually a result of plain poor job by the moviemakers, therefore it isn't really that much deserving for us to try and work out the ambiguity.
P + AC are such movies - and you can see glaring holes all the way. It just takes a lot of time to figure this out the first time. Then you kind of know what to expect.
Who the hell goes and picks up the storyboards, concept works, compares script versions and then watches a movie? Only few dedicated people :)
@BioDegradable (& BigDave): I recently interviewed a veteran comic author who had a historical run on a franchise for decades and learned this, many of the insights fans drew from his work which seemed glaring going right over his head (reinforcing why I established my own blog lo those many years ago). If needed those excesses curbed, I'm always looking for guest posters. You might like to review an example here: https://fanfix.wordpress.com/2013/09/29/pinheads-identity-hellraiser
BioDegradable answered the Replicant Question (Organic Beings) but in response to WHY the Deacon was not Bio-Mechanical, well the Organisms in Alien Covenant were not too... Ridley Scott has mentioned that we are NOT quite their yet, and the Xenomorph has some Evolving to do before it becomes what we see in Alien. So the path they are taking is that its likely some kind of Synthetic Component will be Merged with Davids Xenomorph to make it become the Bio-Mechanical Beast we see in ALIEN... likely something along the lines of the Walter-Morph.
Regarding the Engineers running in Prometheus, i think we need to consider they dont routinely Sacrifice all of themselves only a Chosen Few, and so those Engineers were trying to Escape/Contain the Results of being infected by a Black Goo Outbreak... Some may also say they are running from a Deacon/Xenomorph but the whole what happened to those Engineers is another debate in itself.
The Prequel Drafts to Prometheus (Spaights/Lindeloff) offer TWO different outcomes to what was going on 2000 years ago.
"@BioDegradable: So the UFO carried a Deacon?"
I think the response by BioDegradable may be because they thought you was referring to the Bombardment Scene from Alien Covenant?
In this case the Juggernaughts Payload contains those URNS that indeed appear to carry a Mutagen that has the ability to Evolve/Create Life with the Genetic Makeup of a Deacon, but they may-not be Deacons as we can assume the Juggernaught came from another Temple Complex on LV-223 and we cant rule out that Each Complex had a slightly different form of Xeno-Virus than the others.
This is a assumption on my Part, relating to the Alien Engineers Draft (Prior to Prometheus) that had LV-426 being a Place the Engineers had been Engineering 8 different forms of Xenomorph like Organisms. It was showing us the Juggernaughts had different Cargo Holds that had slightly different versions of the Organism.
If we used this information and considered it when we look at the differences between the Xenomorph in ALIEN and ALIENS then we could put that down to the Eggs/Face Huggers coming from TWO different Cargo Holds.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
"Who the hell goes and picks up the storyboards, concept works, compares script versions and then watches a movie? Only few dedicated people :)"
Certainly and i think at times we maybe do give those working on the Projects to much Credit, where they could just have been LAZY and so the ambiguity is not there for a reason, it could be because those working on it NEVER had any real explanations or intended too.
But from all the Material there is always enough little clues here and there that FANS can piece together to make some Theories that make sense..... but then those working on the Prequels release other clues in Future movies that contradict things and put some SOLID Fan Theories into Question.
Bottom Line is we have to ask if they ever had any real A-Z idea of what they are doing, as it looks like a Make-it-up as they go along... or certainly if they had a A-Z idea, they certainly keep changing elements of it as they go along.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
This is an interesting discussion. It reminds me of all the chaos that went on with Alien 3 and what we finally saw on screen.
Nathan Adler It's all good! It is interesting to see how new ideas can stir up old discussions. I think it is a big contributor to this forum's longevity.
@dk: I just wish we'd get confirmation whether RS is going to be able to proceed with finishing off with his Alien universe "War of the Worlds," attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion.
WAR OF THE WORLDS!
This was a interesting comment that Ridley Scott had made, but it was also a little Tongue in Cheek as he said this was the Direction he wanted to go "only FOX dont know that yet" he had said that he feels the Franchise could go another 5-6 Movies.
I think what this boils down to is that RS sees there is the Potential to Expand the Universe/Franchise and that ONCE you have joined the dots that take you from the Origins of the Xenomorph from Davids Experiments on Planet 4 right to when we get to where those Eggs end up on a Engineer Ship that ends up on LV-426... Ridley Scott feels that while that then Ties us to the events to ALIEN and we then continue with the Franchise Movies and the Companies/Humanities pursuit of the Xenomorph. I feel that what RS was suggesting is that ONCE you reach the event of HOW/WHEN the Derelict Ship ends upon LV-426, there is much more you can expand with the Franchise than just leaving it at that and the events of the ALIEN Franchise.
It seems that RS does-not see the Xenomorph as the main element of the Franchise, well he sees it as the main focus of the Original Franchise but realizes you cant keep going through the same Formula of Humans go on to places where they come upon some Xenomorph Eggs, there is Face Hugging, Chest Busting, Snarling and Killing and reveal Once again its a Set-up so somebody can try and obtain the Xenomorph for their own Nefarious Agenda.
You have to bring something NEW to the Game, and revelations of the Creator/Rebelion Plot that extends to our Creators the Engineers/Space Jockey, and also potential Conflict between Mankind and AI and also maybe even by Virtue of the Plot of Prometheus we have other Creations of those Engineers and even we could ponder WHO created the Engineers.... all of these Elements could lead to a expanded Universe and a WAR OF THE WORLDS like Scenario.
Where the Xenomorph plays a Role as a Organism/Bio-Weapon that whoever can Control it can gain the upper hand in Dominating the Galaxy... but also to bear in mind that the PLOT also allows us to explore other different applications of the Biological Warfare that lead to the Creation of the Xenomorph and open the potential for other similar kinds of Horrific Creations.
There is a PROBLEM with a War of the Worlds plot!!!
It could conflict with the Original Franchise, because their is NO indications of massive conflict with Wayward AI, never mind interaction and battles with the Engineers, let alone other Parties.. It would take one MASSIVE Coverup Operation unless...
The War of the Worlds Events happens...
*At a Time-Period set after ALIEN 3, maybe also ALIEN Resurrection.
*Discounts some of the Original Movies.
*Is set in a FAR FAR away part of the Galaxy away from Earth.
If Ridley Scott went for a War of the Worlds as in a timeline thats set not far after the events that lead to the Derelict and Cargo being on LV-426, we can wonder how this affects what happens after ALIEN.
Ridley Scott did mention about you could re-introduce Ripley as you can CGI her...... could this be taken as the possibility that RS plans could be to Retcon ALIENS on-wards? If so this would allow for his WAR OF THE WORLDS plot to not conflict with the Franchise, well if he Rewrites the History after ALIEN to make his OWN Franchise.
This kind of MOVE would NOT go down well with most Alien Fans and would certainly be SHUNNED by Most.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
Regarding Finishing off the Alien Prequels...
I think we are in a state of LIMBO.... Alien Covenant has kind of written itself into a Corner, ONCE it has set up a Literal Path to ALIEN there is only really ONE ROUTE it can take... it eventually has to lead to ALIEN.
The Problem is that not only has some of the Plot Reveals that link us to ALIEN are now things that are not pleasing to the Majority of the Fanbase.... But also AC had been criticized quite a bit and Financially it was not a Good Success.
There is not a lot of Optimism for the sequels if it continues with the PLOT that seems in place, and so anyone who picks up the BILL to carry on with a sequel has to be aware of the Potential that LESS people may be interesting in seeing a sequel to ALIEN COVENANT.
We are at least TWO Movies away from ALIEN and if the Next Movie is LESS Xenomorph and carries on with the path about being about David and Creation, then i am not sure a Majority of the Fanbase would be interested... and if they go this route and a Sequel BOMBS! then it becomes a even more Greater Risk to carry on with the Final Chapter.. FINANCIALLY
If they made a sequel and its Budget was say $100M and it never made a Good Return, and if it was not connecting enough to ALIEN and about the Aliens enough... then we are left with a STORY that is missing its Final and Important connecting piece to ALIEN. If this movies does-not do well, then they either have to take a HUGE Gamble on Financing a 3rd Movie and Cater for Fanboys, (potentially on lower Budget) and hope this Financially does-not become a FLOP! or they LEAVE it left as it is where we are in a MESS with a kinda set up to ALIEN.. but then No Conclusion.
With Disney in Control they are a company who would not want to be making a Movie that does-not make a Good Return and the Set-up for the Sequel does-not sound a Movie that would Guarantee them a Good Return on a High Budget.
And a LOW $50-60M Budget in say 1-3 years would NOT be easy to do any ALIEN Fanboys vision of a Alien Movie Justice.... because to Produce Multiple Xenomorphs, and Epic HR Giger inspired Scenes, a Derelict/Egg Cargo set and more Space/HR Giger Aesthetic to our Engineers/Space Jockey... would be something HARD to pull off on a Low Budget.
You leave only room for either having Unknown Cast, or making Cuts to the Special Effects which limits the Scope/Sets for the Derelict and Xenomorphs and Engineers etc... so we dont get much of them... or potentially using some Poor CGI.
I think at least a $80-100M Budget would be required to begin to pull off something that Epic and thats a Big Gamble that maybe DISNEY are reluctant to take.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
Unfortunately this is the PICKLE we are now in...
The making the Xenomorph a Recent Creation after the events of Prometheus and at the hands of David is something that has not gone down very well.
This is a consequence of the Following.
*A Prequel (Prometheus) that does not offer enough clues to the Xenomorph Origins or how the Derelict got on LV-426 and had not enough Xenomorph like Scenes. If they had done the above better they could have CLOSED the Door to ALIEN and moved onto something else and a Spin-off that goes away from ALIEN as intended.
*Cracking into some Fan Pressure to give them the Xenomorph Origins and set up HOW the Eggs ended up on the Derelict on LV-426 and Re-Introducing the Xenomorph. Instead of sticking with a Plan to STEER AWAY from ALIEN.
*By doing so and to make the Origins of the Xenomorph and events that lead to the Eggs on LV-426 Literally connect and run after the events of Prometheus, means they have to have a set up to introduce Human Characters (Covenant) and bring the events more closer to home.
By going for a Literal Path from Prometheus ==> Alien and needing to introduce Human Characters, means they had to go with the kind of Plot they had for Alien Covenant (even if they changed the David Creates IT) there is the potential for conflicts with the Franchise....
IF they had gone with the Original Plan to STEER away from ALIEN then RS could have done his WAR OF THE WORLDS by Virtue of having the Engineers abandon our side of the Galaxy and David and Shaw having to travel a Vast Distance to the PARADISE making it a place that is many Thousands of Light Years away or EVEN in another Galaxy. (this is what i aimed in my Prometheus sequels).
So David and Dr Shaw dont turn up to where ever the Engineers are until after the events of ALIENS and we can have Humans because we cant assume that Earth is the only place that Humans had been seeded by our Engineers. The aftermath of such a series of Movies could introduce us to more Fresh Versions of Xenomorphs that reveal how the Xenomorphs may also had been Created, and expand on the Reasons for our Creation and intended Destruction... and then INTRODUCE a War of the Worlds where our Engineers are introduced back into the Alien Franchise at a Time-Line set after Alien Resurrection.
If the FANBOYS got a bit twitchy and impatient then after a Prometheus 2 as such, we could have another movie that gives them a investigation mission to LV-223 where they can introduce a Xenomorph type monster and have less ambiguous clues to how this place related to the Derelict and reveal more about our Engineers but not too much to then WET the Fanboys Appetite to now want to explore those EVIL SOB's who created the Xenomorph.
So you had ONE movie that caters for the Prometheus Fans, and a Parallel one that Caters for the Aliens Fans wanting Answers... and SETS up a 3rd movie set in the Future that is a AMALGAMATION of what would please Prometheus and Aliens fans and set up a WAR OF THE WORLDS
But this path would have been a Risky One as it would mean Committing to TWO separate Sequels to Prometheus were the MONEY would be to go the LV-223 Movie First to please Fanboys and Hook them into then wishing to KNOW more of our Engineers and be interested then in where David and Shaw are going.
But Ridley Scott felt that you have to go NEXT with what happens to David and Dr Shaw....
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
Some comments about this
As far as the original Engineers (Planet 4) versus the one in Prometheus. Maybe the originals created the ones in Prometheus to have them for different missions or purposes? I still think that those on Planet 4 are a bit underwhelming compared to the one in Prometheus but this makes kind of sense when you look at it in that way.
“Who the hell goes and picks up the storyboards, concept works, compares script versions and then watches a movie? Only few dedicated people :)” - Biodegradable
I am one of those nerds if it is a movie that I find interesting enough. This far it has only happened with Prometheus. Your point seems to be that it should be somewhat explained in the movies and I agree about that although some ambiguity is alright so for example everything wasn’t explained in Alien and many people do not seem to have a problem with that but then Alien is light-years ahead of both Prometheus and AC. My point is that there needs to be a balance and that can probably be difficult to find a lot of times.
About explanations that BD says they got to have some sort of plan about where they are going and how they are going to do that. Now it looks like they change it as they go along so for example first it was about the Engineers and then people complained so it became about David and then people complained again. If they would have had a plan from the start it might not have been as chaotic as it is now, that is my point but we have a tricky/crappy situation.
5-6 movies? With AC under-performing the way it did, putting the future of the franchise in doubt, plus his obsession with David he will be lucky if he will make another one. Sure there is a lot that you can show in the franchise the thing is it if it is needed. Probably not, I prefer to leave some things up to the imagination because that is what kept Alien alive for so long. By the way, keeping in mind of how the prequels have done this far I am not sure if I am interested.
“It seems that RS does-not see the Xenomorph as the main element of the Franchise”
I am not sure if I do either, I think that the human journey is more important that is why well done human characters is needed. Unfortunately the prequels have failed with this part and as a result neither of them is very good although there are parts that I enjoy. The thing with the Engineers and why they want to get rid of mankind is interesting but it is just that they have not made it very well this far also I am not very interested in the android part, leave that to another franchise because that is not why I watch these movies because I am interested in the human side of it.
The original three are my favorites, don’t eff that up because if Scott probably as a result of hubris does that then I would be very disappointed.
“This kind of MOVE would NOT go down well with most Alien Fans and would certainly be SHUNNED by Most.”
I would probably pretend that this movie never happened, he has done enough damage as it is.
“But also AC had been criticized quite a bit and Financially it was not a Good Success.”
And for some good reasons:
1. It had weak human characters (my main complaint) so you do not care about most of them. Who can feel something about blank faces? They were like pieces of paper where you have written some sentences, but for it to work you need at least a decent kind of book (a metaphor by the way). Alien 1-3 got this right but then they kind of forgot that we need well done human characters to care for so in that way it has been bad since at least 1997 (which is when they released AR).
2. Only cared about the robots (I think that there is a reason why the discussion between Walter and David is as good as it is because that is what Scott cares about, unfortunately). I need humans to care for, robots are not that interesting in the alien franchise although they have always been part of it. Sure Bishop and Ash were important to the story and I appreciate what they brought to the table but it was never about them, plus:
3. It got rid of the Engineers, a thing that could have been developed a lot more. I would have liked to see what they had as a society with military, religion, weapons, science and so on. Alien Covenant got rid of all this so we didn’t even get clues to it. This is probably the best thing that Prometheus gave us and they just got rid of that, a sign that they did not get the criticism of Prometheus.
I think that Scott and Fox kind of deserved it since a lot (not all) of the movie was lame.
The Xeno is not the most important thing for me because they have had interesting monsters this far. Look at the three point list above to see what I want to see changed.
I think that if they go on with the David-centricity then a lot of people (myself included) will probably not bother. That Scott doesn’t see that this is not the way to go is just not good. He have already given us crap with the idea that David created the Xeno at least they could go with the idea that ADF did that David created his own version from something that the Engineers left behind.
Finishing the prequels: I would rather have none than another one like Alien Covenant. I do not care about another movie where everything is focused on the robots and leaves everything else at second place or worse.
“But Ridley Scott felt that you have to go NEXT with what happens to David and Dr Shaw....”
The problem is that Shaw was not well written and you need more than an android to carry the movie. Maybe he understood the first thing (Shaw) but not the second (about David).
Two more or less underwhelming movies and here we are.
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