Alien Division #2: Reboot vs Carry On!
Posted Aug-16-2017 9:40 PM
In #1, Conspiracy vs Curiosity everyone voted for Conspiracy. I wonder if all of these polls will be as clear cut. If you didn't cast your vote check it out HERE. Each time, as with last time, two absolutes will be on offer, each with three pieces of supporting evidence, all you gotta do is vote one way or the other. It's just for fun, but also helps us gauge our own view of this franchise against those of others. For this one, you will have to imagine your worst nightmare; Alien being remade, so let's begin - Reboot or Carry On, which side do you lean toward...
Whichever angle you look at it from the inevitability of Alien being remade in an effort to reboot the franchise is merely a matter of time, and is likely a possibility 20th Century Fox have put serious thought into. When it happens the movie, be it good or bad, will never replace the original, but may (though likely not knowing Hollywood) prove to be a stepping stone to giving fans the Alien saga they had always wanted.
- Evidence 1 - A remake/reboot could keep the Alien as the central character, not Ripley, and thus delve into its capabilities and evolution without pandering to an actor's demands.
- Evidence 2 - The original vision many of us imagined could be reinstated. Although the Engineers and David are interesting ideas, the fact that Ridley Scott has made the Space Jockey human, and the Xenomorph the result of an androids daddy issues is a proverbial kick in the nuts.
- Evidence 3 - The better themes explored in the original movies and some of those explored in the prequels could be sewn together to make a more complete and less divisive vision of what started out as one of Hollywoods more thought provoking intellectual properties, but has since lost its way.
Though the possibility of a remake/reboot looms in the shadows, the Alien franchise could redeem itself if it can find its center once more. Whether or not that is possible with Ridley Scott remains to be seen and is a matter of opinion. THough not what was originally intended some newly introduced aspects still hold the potential of expanding the mythology of the franchise, potentially reinvigorating it for both modern audiences and the fans.
- Evidence 1 - The Engineers are possibly the best element of the prequel series and could be used to help add much-needed substance to the Alien franchise.
- Evidence 2 - Following a successful remake only gives Fox two options; prequel or sequel. With the current state of the franchise, there are much more avenues to explore.
- Evidence 3 - After Ridley Scotts prequel series Fox could retcon the series like they did with X-Men: Days of Future Past with either the return of Neill Blomkamp's, or possibly even James Cameron's version of Alien 3.
Which side are you one?
Posted Aug-16-2017 10:05 PM
carry on. Ridley has a good thing going on with the prequels in my opinion.
after the prequals are done, I was thinking a series of anthology movies or spinoffs that expand on the universe and suddly tie into the main timeline.
food ain't that bad! - Parker
Posted Aug-16-2017 10:11 PM
Gavin- I say Carry On. Alien has a history that should not be tampered with. Late comers can check for themselves. Sorry to sound less than objective, but the franchise thus far should not change to accommodate noobs quite honestly. The franchise can continue- fine. Leave what has been done.......done.
I will go with where things go, but the past should not be changed imho.
Nice topic for discussion/debate. Up voted.
Posted Aug-16-2017 10:17 PM
my vote is Carry On.
The Ripley Trilogy
The original trilogy + Resurrection as a future spin-off works perfectly fine. Although grim there is a neat, tidy, logical and satisfying story of Ripley going from a blue-collared spacer to the defiant, self-sacrificing heroine of Alien 3.
The David Trilogy
Same goes for the Prequel's, providing Riddlers can tie all the loose ends and overt ambiguity into one big epic tale. Covenant has the feel of a bridging film; between the expansive and insightful Prometheus, to whatever the third film ends up being....Hopefully definitive and grand.
But Fox can't be tempted into bringing Ripley or Family into these prequels. No pre-destiny crap.
The Grand Scale Trilogy
Following the conclusion of Ridley Scott's prequels FOX have an opportunity to start a new chapter without need of a re-boot. The deliberate ambiguity of David/Engineer story and the mystery and personal vendetta of Ripleys story allows them to do whatever they choose going forward.
They should really do an expansive grand scale saga and really open the Alienverse up. Introduce us to the worlds and civilisations that exists within it, the threats, exploration and diplomacy of the major players etc.
Move away from the claustrophobic scale of the previous trilogies but increase the magnitude of threat from the xeno's and/or Engineers.
Put Earth on the line.
Set the franchise up to equal the scale and grandeur of other big franchise but keep to its suspense/horror/mystery roots.
But no more piece-meal or ad hoc scripts. Lock a bunch of writers in a room and don't let them out until they have a comprehensive, logical well written saga that is not short-sighted and contradictory.
Posted Aug-16-2017 10:39 PM
although I don't particularly like alien resurrection, I think there could be another trilogy braching off of it. the xenos are now on earth, the earth is destroyed and the weyland yutani corperation is gone. i was thinking post apoclipse kind of film with xenos
food ain't that bad! - Parker
Posted Aug-17-2017 5:37 AM
I would say carry on, if i was confident that Ridley Scott could stick to one vision. However with Covenant he proved that he can't and i am not sure that he won't mess up with the next movie(s) like he did with Covenant.
So i think that Fox should let Ridley finish the David Arc and remove the franchise from his hands as i think that he is cooked ! I personnaly think that some arc of the Alien EU which could make quite great movie, for example the DR church arc, but i am pretty sure that Ridley can't bring anything worthwhile to the franchise anymore.
Posted Aug-17-2017 5:38 AM
I vote carry on.
I don't think Alien with be remade any time soon. In an interview, Ridley was asked if he would do anything different to Alien and he replied, "No. It's perfect."
Plus, Alien is all about the audience watching the whole process of the Xenomorph and being scared while watching it. Most people already know since the movie was fairly popular and because it has been out for so long. So, I really don't see how Alien could be successfully remade unless it is completely different than the original.
It's best just to leave it alone and carry on. I think Ridley Scott would agree too.
Stars...sky. Exist, yet abyss...
Heaven, Hell... resounding...!
Posted Aug-17-2017 5:45 AM
Carry On? I thought we had that with Alien Covenant? "you blow, and i will do the fingering" those who know the Carry on Movies Innuendo will get that reference.
I do think they have to Carry on but Re-boot some elements well they need to change some things..
Thanks ;) and i totally agree with your points...
I think they have to continue, but then they have to get back to something different and more Horrific.
Lets look at the Hierarchy of Creation as seen in the movies from the Latter to the Prior.
*Xenomorph Davids Creation so it seems... but i wish to concentrate on the Elements prior to this and so here it goes.
*DAVID a creation by Mankind intended only to Serve and Perform Certain Tasks, so that Mankind does no longer have to Perform such Chores... Too Much Free-will and Emotion given to the Android and he then feels he is superior and mistreated and Rebels.
*MANKIND a creation of the Engineers, maybe we can ponder our purpose to the Engineers is similar to the Purpose Mankind created the Engineers. Certain Mythos seems to follow a route of Mankind being created to replace a previous rebellious creation... The Annunaki/Igigi and God/Angels. And here we have Mankind who gain some Knowledge and Awareness not intended that causes us to become rebellious and well to start to not obey or see the Creators as superior to us.
A continuation of exactly what then happens with David.
*ENGINEERS The Gods or are they? Maybe indeed we are seeing the same pattern as above and the Engineers are merely another Humanoid Race Created by another Race to serve a Purpose and these Engineers then also became rebellious to their creators etc.
Thus the Engineers = Igigi and Angels
So i would Propose a few more layers of this continuous Creator, Creation, Rebellion and Sub-Creation.
And i would reveal at the top or near the Top of the Chain is something else and something more Sinister, that could connect very much to the HR Giger Mural.
This Mural to me shows these Humanoid, almost Space Jockey like beings being used in a Ritual to Procreate the Xenomorph, where it seems to show the Ships produced the Eggs and the Ships are Genetically/Synthetically connected to the Xenomorph.
HR Giger had also worked on Face Hugger concepts and these showed Bald Human like beings being Face Hugged by a few different Face Hugger Designs and the suits worn by these beings are not to different to the LV-223 Engineers.
HR Gigers idea was also that the Egg Silo/Chamber actually Produced the Eggs via Bio-Mechanical Pregnant Bellies, and above these was where Gigers Mural was to go.
so i am pretty sure with Gigers work there is something we can revert back to... and have the Engineers also merely being a Race Created for a Purpose.. a Sacrificial Purpose.
I hope that the only AWAKENING we are in for is FOX/RS wake up and learn from their mistakes.
Posted Aug-17-2017 5:47 AM
Knee jerk reactions towards movies always happen.
Nostalgia will kick in for all the Alien movies....I've seen it happen for just about any movie series or stand alone. Good or bad...the ratings will start to climb and in 20 years Alien:Covenant will be a misunderstood masterpiece. Just like Alien3....Alien: Resurrection is 61% on Google and that will continue to climb...........
Posted Aug-17-2017 6:02 AM
And who runs this series? Fox or the director?
There is no way I'd direct a film.....Fox would be in way...It'd be Fox's vision not mine. Why would any director want that!?
It's why Cameron made Avatar...His series....He has 100% control. Probably too late for Ridley to start his own 'Avatar'.
Posted Aug-17-2017 9:15 AM
Carry on! Haha so far, this is very clear cut (again)! IRaptus pretty much hit the nail on the head!
Ripley had her story told nicely through three films (and the fourth sort of spinoff added to it without ruining it... If you look at it in an optimistic way)
David has his trilogy (possible quadrilogy. David may even perish in a third film and the fourth would be similiar to Resurrection in it's continuation, but distance) and then after a few years and once there is a plan in place (continuity and decision making can't jump all over the place) Fox can set out to make a new trilogy or a connected universe type of deal.
Not a map, an invitation
Posted Aug-17-2017 10:08 AM
I kind of want to say let the franchise rest for a bit after this prequel trilogy, but if I had to choose 1, it would be carry on, simply because even if the rest of the series has been mediocre to bad, the first 2 films are so good I don't want to see them get rid of them.
Now if we wanted to reboot everything besides those 2 I might be on board.
Posted Aug-17-2017 6:48 PM
BigDave said, "so i am pretty sure with Gigers work there is something we can revert back to... and have the Engineers also merely being a Race Created for a Purpose.. a Sacrificial Purpose."
To me, this sounds like that is what the story is planned on being. The reason being is found in the first scene of Prometheus. The Engineer in the cloak is standing all by himself with the cup that will tear his DNA a part. He looks up at a spacecraft which we viewers have never seen before. It's almost like he is thinking as he looks back at the cup that will kill him, "This is what I am supposed to do whether I like it or not." As the spacecraft starts to ascend into space he thinks, "I better drink up. This is my purpose." He then starts dying and is in shock of what is happening to his arm. He's never seen this before. The pain doesn't matter as much as what is happening to him. He stands till his legs break and falls in the water until he turns molecular.
I think that is why they only left him on the planet and took out the other cloaked Engineer figures. The way it was released just would simplify the interpretation.
Hopefully we figure out what that ship was, but most likely we won't. I think a good prequel sequel will not connect the dots and have the movie stand on it's own in addition to being the connecting prequel to Alien and the final sequel to the previous prequels. Having the movies stand on their own is something I think Ridley is trying to do with all the prequels. I mean, Prometheus and Alien: Covenant are very different from one another. So, I am expected the same variety in the Alien: Awakening.
I do hope Fox doesn't blow the chance to reboot the Alien franchise without Ridley Scott motivating everyone. They have the chance to bring anything and whoever they want into it's production. It's exciting, really. Hopefully Ridley will put the Alien franchise down after Alien: Awakening.
Stars...sky. Exist, yet abyss...
Heaven, Hell... resounding...!
Sign in to add a reply to this topic!