How Did David Create the Protomorph? Was he Developing a Queen? Alien: Advent - Explained --- by Alien Theory
A closer look at David's experiments, and the intentions behind them, as portrayed in "Alien: Advent," a short film included with Alien: Covenant's digital and Blu-ray release.
Interesting video. I'm surprised Scott would go for the Queen idea, then again he did say he liked Cameron's idea. Not sure if this means a literal queen by gestating one in Daniels or turning Daniels into a pseudo-queen like David did with Shaw, which perhaps didn't work correctly because Shaw was dead. It's such a sad story for Shaw, what a horrible fate.
Plus, now we have one more question answered: David shared the info, so Weyland Yutani (or a section of it) knows everything.
Maybe RS is allowing for the queen idea to keep options open for future films?
I don't think Ridley Scott would go for the Cameron's idea of a giant ant alien queen although he was polite at the time Aliens was released. It may be another mislead from Fox. I hope David will fail with his experiments and next movie will not feature Daniels or an ant queen. They are both overcooked.
"He survived, he’s now in Disneyland in Orlando, and no way am I going back there. How did he end up in Disneyland? I saw him in Disneyland, Jesus Christ!"
I will have to wait to see the Advent video so i can properly debate it
I think its very open to what is meant by the Queen...
It does not have to mean that David Creates a Queen as per say.
We need to pay attention to Prometheus more than Alien Covenant for clues, the only Life Form similar to the Xenomorph and the Mural was the Deacon which was birthed from the Trilobite which acted as pretty much a Face Huger.
The route to create this Xenomorph Relative was Black Goo contaminating Dr Shaws Re-productive Organs, this would be via one of either.
1) Holloways Sperm infected with the Xeno-Virus Parasitic Pathogen, Fertilizes one of Shaws Eggs.
2) The Xeno-Virus Parasitic Pathogen used the Sexual encounter between Holloway to pass to Shaws Womb where it infected one of her Eggs (thus Holloway was a means of Transmission much like a STD).
3) As above but instead of infecting one of Shaws Eggs, the Parasitic Pathogen was able to use Shaws Womb to Gestate and Evolve into a Trilobite.
I would discount option 3, due to the Deacon being born with a Umbilical Cord.
So for David a starting point would be to Replicate the Experiments on LV-223 which i was informed was to a degree Davids Agenda in the Prometheus 2 drafts.
David would maybe wonder what the outcome of Shaws Baby Trilobite would have been, assuming he never sees or knows about the Deacon outcome.
So a starting point for David depends on how Dr Shaw was infected... If it was Option 1) Mutated Holloways Sperm.
Then David could ponder what Dr Shaws Eggs plus direct infection from the Black Goo would instead create.
if we go to Alien Covenant, then David has at some point experimented and cross experimented with a number of different Life Forms and he referred to Dr Shaw as his Greatest Specimen.... and also those Eggs are his Greatest Achievement but he lacked Hosts for the Eggs at this point... until the arrival of the Covenant Crew.
So its likely that these Eggs needed Dr Shaws Eggs as part of their Process of Creation. It would appear from the Advent description that David intended to Evolve Dr Shaw and in some way have her become a Queen.... This again fits with the intention for Prometheus 2 as far as the Source i had over 2.5 years ago mentioned.
But AC did not go this route, the Advent seems to hint David wanted to evolve Shaw, but she objected and so he had to kill her and Harvest her Organs for Experiments.
Thus likely her Eggs became the Xenomorph Eggs.
So we can now assume Davids intentions may have been to test these Eggs, but then also to infect Shaw and make her into a Hybrid and then we can ponder what would a Xeno/Shaw Hybrid do as far as Procreation? What would become of her Reproductive Capabilities once she is a evolved Hybrid.
Indeed some of the Concept work touched upon this
So indeed maybe this was the intention of David, and now he may have these plans for Daniels? However even going as far as just Harvest Daniels Eggs and then infect them would make her kind of his Queen.
These concepts above, are pretty much similar to what the Source i had 2.5 years ago had described, and Chris can validate this as they did hint that Dr Shaw would become in effect Sin from the Paradise Lost Poem and one of the TWO Monster Designs would be based of one of the Original Xenomorph Designs, but wont be a Xenomorph and the other would be based off Necronom 4 but again wont be a Xenomorph and well the Necronom 4 was the Original idea, well HE Giger design they chose to follow and base the Original Alien off... so this rules out Necronom 4 for the other Monster, which brings me to the First Original Design Giger had done for the Monster in Alien.
Which somewhat we can see those Dr Shaw concepts kind of take some traits from.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
I don't think RS is going to use James Cameron's queen for his movie. I feel like it would be more like David attempting to mutate a female, probably Daniels, into a type of Xenomorph queen. Something like the way Giger's Alien life cycle painting depicts. David said he had to be forceful with Shaw because she protested him cleansing Planet 4. Then he wanted to make her a queen but she died. Judging by the growths around/under her head, it looks like he may have attempted to turn her into a queen to create eggs, but maybe she died during the transformation, or maybe she was still/already dieing from the Trilobyte birth. I think in the next movie David will perfect this and turn Daniels into some grotesque queen that can generate eggs for David.
Since he was trying to tame the neomorphs, or gain their trust, he will probably have to do this with whoever becomes the queen, since the mutagen always makes the infected person violent. Maybe Shaw became violent with him during the mutation, leading him to have to "put her down."
@Ati - "I have the feeling that at/from 3:40 we see Shaw's neck and head - yeah, David removed Shaw's head from the body..."
I think that is actually the neck from this alien head, not Shaw. She is on a table deeper into the room.
@ BigDave, Sorry but I call BS on most of your theory. "I would discount option 3, due to the Deacon being born with a Umbilical Cord."? WTF? You do realise that the Deacon was born from an Engineer right? Not directly from Shaw? How does this effect anything? Obviously the Trilobite was just an infected sperm..or group of sperms from Holloway. David infected Shaw seperately. Also I find this idea that the "eggs came from Shaw" to be rather strange. Humans DONT HAVE EGGS. Human women have single cells in their ovaries. We call them eggs but they are not the same as birds eggs ...or alien eggs. Who do we know who had eggs? Well..the Neomorphs do. When they reproduce they probably lay those fungus-like egg sacs..which then give off more parasitic spores. I think David combined the egg of a Neomorph with the infected egg of Shaw to create the Ovomorph + facehugger we know and love. See here for more - http://www.alien-covenant.com/topic/45368
Indeed i meant to say the what looks like a Placenta.. not Umbilical cord. I did get bit confused and i do time to time right the wrong words for what i meant lol... The Trilobite had a Umbilical cord though.
And yes its not to say 100% that the Deacon was born with a Placenta either, as usually this would require a womb. So it could be a Engineer Internal Organ but it does look more like a Placenta, which i agree seems out of place... but we dont really know how much thought they put into that scene.
I have watched and studied Prometheus plenty of times though, and while indeed Infected Holloway Sperm is a likely scenario which i have not denied, the other potential could be that the Goo part that David used contained Nano-Worms
This would explain the Eye-worm and some of the Prop work they was considering using for Holloway had like Worms growing from him.
Then again this could just be a case of Alien infected Sperm on his Face... lol but yeah these are either infected Sperm Cells or indeed Nano-Worm Parasites.
While i know Human Eggs are technically Egg Cells and Birds and Reptiles are encased in a membrane that hardens to create the Shells. A Egg is still used to describe the female reproductive cell of most Animals.
So when i was referring to Eggs from Shaw i meant as far as her Egg Cells, surely not that she Pops out Eggs lol
But then we dont know if a Hybrid Female Human would Produce Eggs, and so their Egg Cells evolve into some kind of Xenomorph Eggs, we just dont know. As the movie seems to show a different Fate for Dr Shaw.
But still her Egg Cells could be used to create those Xenomorph Eggs or play a key role in how they came to be....
I dont mean to be picky... but i would not consider the Neomorphs to have Eggs, there is no evidence to suggest a Neomorph lays those Eggs.... not that i am aware of, so i would be interested if there is some as that would be interesting.
The Spores just appear to be some kind of Hybrid Creation created from the Black Goo that disperse the Xeno-Virus if you will via Motes.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
"I think David combined the egg of a Neomorph with the infected egg of Shaw to create the Ovomorph + facehugger we know and love."
I think there is the posibility of this for sure, i can see what you mean by Neomorph Eggs as in not the Neomorphs themselves but that the Spore Motes infect other Lifeforms to Produce a kind of Insect version of the Neomorph, and these could then lay infected Egg Sacks.
Indeed surely this could happen, i have not read the Novel all the way yet, just glanced at it and indeed i agree the Novel can lead to this but its ambiguous. And so it could imply the infected insects with the Neomorph Spores if thats what we can call them... could indeed lay Eggs, or a Egg sack but this maybe is not 100% proof they lay the same Egg Sacks we see near the Water Stream, but who knows... another theory i would think could be these Spores are related to some Fungi that are infected via the Black Goo as left over Goo seaped from the Crashed Cargo Hold and ran down and into the stream of Water that flows from teh Mountain, under and into the Cargo Hold (as the Ships has crashed into the Mountain where the Stream was running) and then down to the water side where Ledwood also got infected... we see near this water both near the Stream at the bottom and the water running into the Cargo Hold we have like Moss/Algae and so Plant Life, and then surely some kind of Mold/Fungi could grow there too and when infected with the Black Goo, Mold/Fungi are not Plant Life and so could Evolve to pass on those Spores.
This indeed is what some of the concept work has shown, and going even further back before AC, Alien Paradise Lost showed Plant Life infected by the Black Goo would actually release these Motes.
I would say David has conducted many experiments, he even has Urns in his Laboratory and has some of them with the internal structure that holds the Glass Vials on his Table.
If David was to conduct experiments, then surely part of his plan would be to see what he can gain and experiment with by using the Substance that is stored within those Glass Vials and the First time he experimented with this was on Holloway.
This lead to the Trilobite and so i would be sure David would want to try and replicate some of these results.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
Loving how some of the most viewed and respected Youtubers, no names mentioned but most of the Bigger Ones...
Are all speculating that David is going to create a Xenomorph Queen.... i think anyone expecting anything like the Xenomorph Queen will be disappointed ;)
I think RS will not go the Queen route not Cameron's Queen..
In effect i think David needs a Female for their Re-productive Capabilities alone. Imagine if for example you David could use the Black Goo to infect in small quantity Dr Shaw or Daniels Egg CELLS and we can wonder would this evolve them into a Face Hugger type Organism, the Trilobite was however the Trilobite could be via infected Human Sperm.
Even if this is the case, David did have access to Engineer Body's and some of the stuff in his workshop does look like it would require more fresh or even alive Engineers rather than the Charred Corpses outside.
So David could maybe have Engineer Sperm and Egg Cells.
Regardless my point is that David would maybe be interested in Re-creating the Trilobite, and in Alien Covenant he has access to Females and Males.
Because if we say look at David having access to a Female, and a Male if indeed infected Sperm is needed... then David could impregnate a Female, then remove the Trilobite/Face Hugger type Organism, then repair the Female and Repeat.
I think a interesting thing is that David only has TWO Face Huggers, and so the Question is how does David procreate more than TWO Xenomorphs, does he go the Egg Morph route? Or do they go for a Queen and does one of those Face Huggers lead to a Queen, or does a Egg Morph lead to a Queen?
Regardless i just dont think RS will go this route to give us a very Xenomorph related Queen, thats not to far off Camerons. But i guess we have to wait and see.
And so then we have to wonder how much Genetic knowledge does David have and what Tools are there on the Covenant in order for him to maybe use the DNA of those Face Huggers to Create more, or infect a Females Egg Cells etc?
The other option would be Black Goo, surely David would want to have more of this stuff to experiment because this stuff is the Key to Creation, but then this would mean David going back to get some Urns..
However they could just as easy show us David managed to sneak one of the Glass Vials or a Few while he was also getting the Face Hugger Embryos.
R.I.P Sox 01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017
Hey, just got back here from having been away since the end of May. So, as usual, Advent leaves me still with a lot of questions.
1. The spore pods are shown, again (not sure if it's a cut-out from the film or we see David disturbing them). But, again, there is no mention of what they are or how they came to be, which still seems like a really important part of this story to me that I feel isn't going to be explained. Since we know that plants didn't get mutated, are we still working under the theory that these are eggs of a creature native to the planet that got transformed, or that David created them? Their location seems to be completely random, which is why I'm leaning towards the former.
2. Another site mentions that in addition to Shaw, he can be seen experimenting on an Engineer(s), and a Neomorph. It's shown in the movie that the neomorph is the result of the spores on human beings, and I'd just figured the ones we saw in the movie where the first to have been created since we don't see any neomorphs of the same kind in the lab in the movie. I guess we're just supposed to assume the first neomorph came from his experimentation on Shaw, but are we supposed to assume it came from an experiment on her when she was alive (maybe lead to some spores), or an experiment on her eggs?
David seems to have been fascinated with what came out of Ledward and Hallett, as if he'd not seen anything like it before. Maybe then the neomorph he creates from Shaw is of a different type than the one that occurred naturally?
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