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Alien: Covenant

Alien: Covenant - Prometheus sequel by Ridley Scott

Alien: Covenant

The Alien: Covenant & Prometheus Movie Community

Half-exposed ovoid emerald in the ampule room

Nathan Adler

Member

19

Posted Jul-02-2017 1:41 AM

What is the deal with the half-exposed oblong emerald object in the ampule room that appears to have something inside it? While the shape is similar to the vase-like container that David removes, you’ll also note it’s larger, greener and more ovoid than the vase, closer to that of an egg.  What is its connection and why is it placed ceremoniously in front of the alien mural and embedded in the stone altar?

Replies

sherris

Member

21

Posted Jul-02-2017 2:37 AM

Stand back everybody. Stand back....

BigDave is on his way;)

Take This.... This is the blood of our lord

sherris

Member

21

Posted Jul-02-2017 2:42 AM

NathanAdler - Great question.

The colour is most interesting to me.

It has the glow - and the green seems to be the same colour green that, when David examines the Engineer Door and gets some goo on his fingers, he takes a closer look and the substance on his gloves seems to contain micro particles that are the same colour?

Any thoughts on possible connection ?

Take This.... This is the blood of our lord

Capt Torgo

Member

0

Posted Jul-02-2017 6:11 AM

Michelle thought it contained or was an Alien head. I think either DNA from amber type like Jurassic park as Covenant showed proof Ridley will borrow from lots of places. Another theory is alchemy/ sorcerer stone as the urns and goo all seem to relate to all kinds of madness. Furious Gods at 1:49 showed the altar and item but had a bright light blocking a good viewing. The back half looks carved open so who knows. Good luck findimg your answers

Starlogger

Moderator

44

Posted Jul-02-2017 9:44 AM

I read something someone posted on this awhile back, and if I'm not mistaken, it was changed to the "green gem" in post, as the trailers showed something else in that very spot (I don't remember exactly what it was)...some of the youtube "experts" (Mr H, Alien Theorist, Hybrid/NickH) have theorized on what it could represent...but there is nothing definitive.

Now...patiently awaiting BigDave's 14 page exposition to explain it all so clearly... ;)

JOHNNYMORPH

Member

0

Posted Jul-02-2017 10:04 AM

Always though Holloway should of investigated the green object alot more. It seemed to have some importance to the Engineers.

Holloway should've removed it, bagged it up and run tests on it back on the Prometheus.

It was a very interesting object and testing it could've provided some answers.

Michelle Johnston

Member

0

Posted Jul-02-2017 10:19 AM

Mine and Lone's view is it is the buried head of a Deacon. Charlie looks at it and the mural and says "this is just another tomb" which in an earlier script was said outside the headroom door. As soon as I saw it in the cinema it reminded me of an ALIEN skull. 

In the trailers a sacrificial cup was in its place suggesting the  Deacon is caught up in the ritual of sacrifice, note the christ like pose of the lower Deacon in the mural who appears to be bathing in what of course could become the mutagen in the urns. 

Big Dave has said before it is a shard of the source power of the Engineers that would have been revealed in Prometheus : Pandemonium (one of the titles for the original Prom 2).

Its knowing how visual Ridley is that to put in ones mind an Alien skull seems to me to much like coincidence.

Interestingly in all other respects BD and I share the same view about what is recorded in the headroom. Some elements are Easter Eggs but some like the frescos had genuine intent to tell the story of LV223. The theft of the catalyser and to experiment with their own sub creation driven by their hubris which turned round and got out and destroyed them. The creator/creation parallax which repeats itself with the engineers/xeno strain and Mankind/A. I. all three elements of which will come together in the next prequel. Pietro the editor has recently said they talked about Milton's Paradise Lost as applied to fallen angels and the Engineers on LV 223 represent that. They stole the forbidden fruit and suffered punishment and if it is stolen again the Promethean punishment of the ripping out of ones entrails will repeat itself over and over again. To seek the catalyser and harness it is to unleash the devil.  

It is merely speculation on my part but I believe the catalyser was booby trapped and its misuse generated punishment. Just as mankind entering the headroom set off the atmospheric changes, the fresco mutation and the leaking of the urns and created the storm. In one of the tie books you can clearly see the fresco turns into an Alien Egg - a prophecy that the coming of mankind to LV223 leads to the XXX121. Indeed the barren Elizabeth sets in motion the forerunner.

      

Capt Torgo

Member

0

Posted Jul-02-2017 11:04 AM

Thanks Michelle as always! This stuff almost flies over my head. I could see that as a head cause it's pointed at one end and curved on the side facing the deacon wall mural. Lots of heads everywhere so who knows I just wish they could have given us a cleaner look but......part of the appeal of Prometheus was the guessing. Not sure I even care to guess about Covenant but oh well. The search continues.....

Michelle Johnston

Member

0

Posted Jul-02-2017 11:51 AM

I forgot to mention that the shape fused into the alter it is a mixture of Green (the hint of good life) and black (the hint of the Xeno Strain) which echoes the vial that David opens up which is green with black threads in it. 

Yes the beauty of Prometheus to me is you are not spoon fed and left many puzzles to consider and mull over. However what has happened with Covenant is many of those speculative avenues have been abandoned and yet ironically the core of the connection with Prometheus, the David/Elizabeth story and to a lesser extent the creation of the life cycle have not been lit with the kind of certainty that would have fulfilled us.

I also think the whats next could have been handled in a more exciting and compelling way. Imagine if in the last frame we returned to the desolate quiet of Paradise to look upon the cave, Walter and to see the return of an Engineer juggernaut that would really have set things up beautifully and set keyboards on fire - after all this is meant to an episodic connected trilogy .    

JOHNNYMORPH

Member

0

Posted Jul-02-2017 11:54 AM

Buried head of a Deacon?!

It's quite clearly not that. It's emerald green and transparent, crystal/glass-like. The Deacon is a blue/grey colour and not see-through. It's also the wrong shape to be a Deacon head.

My guess is that it is a power source/control for operating systems in the head room, either that or an ancient DNA sample of xeno/pathogen which is held in high regard by the Engineers.

Kethol

Member

38

Posted Jul-02-2017 3:47 PM

I agree, this definitely not a deacon head. This jem is probably some parallel to amber. I always presumed it held the original form or the pathogen, hence is position on an altar at the foot of a mural depicting the various creations it can be used for.

Basically it is just saying 'from this, came all of this'.

Ridley has hinted a few times that the Engineers are not the ones who designed humans, so it may be that they found, stole, or were given the original material from which all forms of the pathogen are based. Hence all the suggestions at parallels to the story of Prometheus.

BigDave

Moderator

267

Posted Jul-02-2017 4:42 PM

I can see how it looked like a Xenomorph type Head, the rear of the head... but i am not sure thats the case, but we have no official answer so any thing goes really.

I think MICHELLE summed up most of it spot on..

Originally it had a Sacrificial Bowl/Cup

This was very clever work by RS to show us the scale of the Engineers as we see the size difference to Holloway compared to the Sacrificial Engineer, the difference would make the Engineers 12-15ft Tall.... But Alas with no Special Effects etc all we got was 7ft Actors who looked 7.5ft in most of the shots.

But the Mural in Sacrificial Pose, is to represent Sacrifice, Christians worship Christ on the Cross not because of it showing GOD, but that it showed Christ had Sacrificed himself to Save Mankind.

Jon Spaights Alien: Engineers had the Engineer take Cruciform pose before he was broken down and fell into the Water-fall..... in his Draft the Goo was replaced by Scarabs and when we see how they worked in his Draft... and apply it to Prometheus then we can see the Deacon Mural shows the Engineers had Sacrificed this Organism to then Create the Goo that is contained within the Urns.... the Deacon Organism was thus exposed to the Sacrificial Goo.

But during the Edit of Prometheus a lot of Scenes was cut, and a lot of changes compared to how the movie was to be prior to Shooting...  They (FOX) attempted to address the Black Goo by releasing a File that explained it but this just contradicted the movie.

The Crystal was thus a replacement maybe to show a Change of Direction to where they was going.

A Source i had who claimed to have information and seen a few early concepts for Prometheus 2 as of November 2014 had claimed that  Paradise was a loose version of Paradise from the Bible, a Place where Humanoid Creation came from.

This place had among a Orchard that was at the end of a like path/courtyard that was described to be like some Ancient Egyptian Valley of the Kings/Luxor Monuments.. at the end of this Path  was a Obelisk that was neither Rock or Metal and it appeared to be Growing from the Ground with Roots... it had some Markings on it... but at the center it Glowed Green

This was in effect the Biblical Tree of Life and Tree of Knowledge, it was the Source of the Engineers (or their Hierarchy) Tool for Creation and Power.

Thus the LV-223 Engineers had Stolen a Shard of this Crystal Obelisk....  The Obelisk thus likely the Source of the Sacrificial Goo.

But again i can not confirm if this information is correct, only if we see a Paglen/Green Draft or related concept work released would we be able to see if this was correct.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Kethol

Member

38

Posted Jul-02-2017 4:58 PM

I never saw the ultramorph/protomorph arms-wide pose as anything to do with sacrifice, although clearly something is destroyed to create using the pathogen.

I saw the arms-wide pose as simply the ultramorph/protomorph figure being central result, and the arms encompassing the various forms of creation all around it in the mural.

Even David spread his arms wide when his 'success' was born, and it did the same back to him.

BigDave

Moderator

267

Posted Jul-02-2017 4:59 PM

@Kethol

Agree with your last post, this has to be a connection.. i however think we need to not read into Ridley Scotts did not create Humans comment.

I feel it was a misquote...

"So we've reinvented the idea of Alien, I think, which is that Covenant gets us a step closer to who and why was this thing designed to make human beings. And if you think it's them [the Engineers], you're dead wrong"

We have to understand AC was to show us how the Xenomorph came to be and Who created it, a lot of us would think the Engineer/Space Jockey Race... which is where RS pointed out And if you think it's them [the Engineers], you're dead wrong Ridley Scott was pointing at the Large Head Room in Alien Covenant when he made this comment.

I think what RS means is to Replace MAKE with Destroy or Kill.

"So we've reinvented the idea of Alien, I think, which is that Covenant gets us a step closer to who and why was this thing designed to KILL/DESTROY human beings. And if you think it's them [the Engineers], you're dead wrong"

If you then look at that and see how its revealed David created the Xeno and not the Engineers and David created such a Horrid Weapon to destroy Mankind then AC has all the clues to back this up... 

Then again its how i see it, the direct quote could have meant otherwise but i think RS meant Kill and not Create.

Here is another Interview RS had made this comment

"If the engineers were the forerunners of the human race on Earth, and therefore were creators of life forms in places that were possible for biology to function.

But who created that?

Where's the big boy?

Or should we think this was all an accident?"

And so i think its likely the Engineers played a role in our Creation at the very least Genetically we are connected, the Sacrificial Scene was to show how Mankind was created.

But this could be any place, even Paradise and so if the Sacrificial Scene lead to Humanoids on Paradise, at some point the result of this Sacrificial Scene, (Humanoids) would have played a Role in how Mankind came to be.

I really hope we delve deeper into all of this in future movies.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

Moderator

267

Posted Jul-02-2017 5:05 PM

I think Kethol this is the great thing with Prometheus, its ambiguity and so no one theory can be claimed as 100% what has happened, its left open to debate where many people can come to different conclusions.

I think Originally it had a Sacrificial Purpose.. but then we dont know how they are evolving the Franchise and so indeed the Scene with David and the Chest Buster where David raised his arms can look like the same as the Deacon.

I saw that Scene as David raising his hands a a Puppet Master does to then allow the Puppet via strings to perform the same pose.  Thus showing David is the Master and Creator of these Organisms.

But again thats how i saw that scene and people will come to different conclusions which is all part of the fun of debating on here.... Where there is Ambiguity it opens up for debate...

Lindeloff is kind of proud of Prometheus for this, as he stated in a Interview before.. that if there was no Ambiguity and it was all Spoon Fed then Websites and Youtube would have less to Talk About.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Kethol

Member

38

Posted Jul-02-2017 5:11 PM

I don't think Ridley mis-spoke at all. When he said "this thing designed to make human beings", the "thing" he was referring to was the creation goop we see in Prometheus prologue. He was just saying if you think the Engineers made that stuff, you are wrong. That's what I heard, anyway.

Damon Lindeloff hinted at this many times in interviews as well, saying things like "there are these beings that may or may not have created us".

IndyFront

Member

2

Posted Jul-03-2017 5:25 AM

@Kethol I think you're dead on. I wonder if what Ridley is getting at is that humans and engineers have the same originator and are cousins. Imagine how insane it would be if we all came from the pathogen... IE- it was the first form of life and the biotechnology is a dormant state, as if it is a superorganism fooling them/us into thinking we are the puppet masters when in fact it is the opposite. It would be the best tribute to Giger if, in fact, the Juggernauts are ALIVE.

Capt Torgo

Member

0

Posted Jul-03-2017 6:00 AM

Big Dave your glowing rock/tree/generator might be the best guess other than DNA/amber or alchemy stone. In Furious Gods there are digital concept pictures of the crew going deeper into the depths of the once much larger pyramid structure. At its core was this crazy rock with a glowing center it also had stuff like crystal organics growing on it. Maybe it's that concept boiled down as somehow them entering the ampule chamber = triggers a storm + removes cooling stasis of room to activate goo. I found the green slime on that recording panel (David rubs fingers) to just be a leaking power source. So is it connected to their temple power supply or is the parked juggernaut the source. My second best guess I think is, its DNA in crystal they found(somewhere in cosmos) and combined with the catalyzer they stole and mixed it to create madness....kinda like N. Korea with nukes.

Michelle Johnston

Member

0

Posted Jul-03-2017 8:18 AM

There is some confusion developing here. 

He was on the set of Covenants headroom when he made the statement to visiting journalists "if you think they made him (the Xenomorph) your dead wrong" he did not say who did.

However after the movie was released he has done multiple interviews one of which is over 7 minutes long which I just rewatched  and he made the same point and finishes off by saying "its far more interesting" that David made the Xenomorphs rather than the Engineers and the reasoning is that having destroyed the Engineers (or so he thinks) he wants to destroy mankind who are not worthy for reasons he express's in Covenant.

Those conversations are not about mankind they revolve around Covenant and whom made the Xenomorphs.

@Indyfront

If you have seen Prometheus you will know the entire proposition is that mankind was seeded by the Engineers we share their DNA. They repeatedly visited us over ten of thousands of years taking an interest in our progress until they finally decided having created us they would redact us. So your guess is spot we are the creation of the Engineers the intergalactic space gardeners we are to use your words cousins.

@Kethol 

I like your idea that the fused item in the alter is a receptacle for the catalyser. My problem with that is it does relate in any visual sense to the Urns and nor does it leak when the atmosphere changes or have any other dramatic value. But for me the compelling reason your wrong is there is nothing in the dialogue of Charlie to hint at any ambiguity and in the end stories are about visuals, actions and dialogue. 

I must say you are the first person I have ever come across who fails to make the connection that the deacon the forerunner of the protomorph as Ridley describes the former, is not in  a sacrificial pose. I have studied many artefacts, artistry of Judo/ Christian/ Hindu and even Moslem tradition and the idea a spreadeagled creature is embracing rather than crucificalo is outside of my experience.

We do know from both Damon and Ridley a key theme of Prometheus is sacrifice so to create a mural within that film that is not about sacrifice seems counter intuitive to me.

I would welcome some examples of religious iconography where your theory that it is an open handed gesture surrounded by the achievements. Also you should be aware the artist who made the mural indicated the surrounding elements should be viewed as Easter Eggs.    

 

Kethol

Member

38

Posted Jul-03-2017 9:48 AM

I see why you are making that connection and think that the something-morph in the mural represents sacrifice, I just completely disagree with it. There are obvious sacrificial elements to the actions of the Engineers when they create, but that does not mean every symbol in the movie implies sacrifice. They also destroy.

The Christ figure in the Christ the Redeemer statue in Brazil is holding his arms out in the same manner, and he was sacrificed in that pose. But just because he is in that pose does not mean that statue is meant to convey his self sacrifice. His outstretched arms and open hands are meant to convey a welcoming symbol of peace, among other things. One of the designers said it was also a monument to science, art and religion. See the difference?

The only sacrificial elements I see in the mural are the face-hugged Engineers (if that is what they are) that are being used, or allowing themselves to be used, as incubators for the something-morphs.

"My problem with that is it does relate in any visual sense to the Urns and nor does it leak when the atmosphere changes or have any other dramatic value. But for me the compelling reason your wrong is there is nothing in the dialogue of Charlie to hint at any ambiguity and in the end stories are about visuals, actions and dialogue. "

I don't think it would leak because the material was removed long ago, but how do you know nothing leaked? It was only shown one time, very briefly. And why would it relate in a visual sense to the urns?

Also, I'm not sure what you are talking about regarding Charlie's dialogue. He never mentioned the emerald jem in the movie. No one did.

Thoughts_Dreams

Member

15

Posted Jul-03-2017 10:17 AM

Sherris: LMAO! Thanks

 

I also wonder of it is a sort of amber type, just like Capt Torgo says. Maybe the stone has some sort of DNA in it that were used to create Xenos or something similar. Doesn’t it pour out green slime out of the Xenos when they get shot in Aliens?

 

Yes it pours green out of an alien. If you pause the video (Aliens) at 1:00:19 into the movie you see a Xeno getting hit by a bullet. Some sort of yellow green slime pours out of it. Maybe it has got something to do with the green sacrificial stone to do since yellow and green are in the same kind of color scale? Compare it to how it is done in a photo editor program were yellow and green are close to each-other. Of course I can be totally mistaken but I find it to be a bit interesting. By the way, you also see that kind of slime when they try to remove the face-hugger from I think that his name was Kane in Alien.

IndyFront

Member

2

Posted Jul-03-2017 11:44 AM

That is their acidic circulatory fluid.

Nathan Adler

Member

19

Posted Jul-03-2017 11:47 AM

@Michelle Johnston: Can you please provide the link to the "over 7 minutes long" interview?

What doesn't make sense re: Prometheus, is that it reveals the Engineers intended to drop bacteriological drums of shit on us 2,000 years ago and yet Shaw's notes show they were still watching over us until 1,000AD (i.e. Toltec Temple of the Feathered Serpent, Xochicalco, Mexico and Chaco Canyon, New Mexico respectively)!?

@Kethol: Can you please provide the reference where "One of the designers said it was also a monument to science, art and religion"?

Michelle Johnston

Member

0

Posted Jul-03-2017 12:26 PM

@Nathan Adler

The remarks are mid point.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qo30bZc10D0

@Ketho

"I always presumed it held the original form or the pathogen"

My apologies I had missed you believe it is an empty container. My problem with that is I can see elements of black and green within it as if it is frozen tissue. This for me is the dormant dead material that echoes the material that David extracts from a vial. The Deacon is part humanoid and therefore in death would contain elements of the humanoid catalyser and the introduced Xeno strain. The reason its green is for matters of presentation so you can see it and thematically the holographic key is also green as well as the vials.

On the matter of the dialogue freeze frame the movie Charlie looks at the mural, looks at the submerged elongated shape and says its just another tomb. Prometheus is so low on exposition dialogue every piece that is in their crunches out key back story much of which comes from David "in order to create first one must destroy" I see very few examples of dissembling elements of the narrative unlike Covenant David lies about the destruction about Shaw and in my view the Egg. Therefore my instinctive reaction which I had five years ago was wow this shape its like an Alien (if they didn't want that connection then why not leave an example of the sacrificial bowl which then connects as you would want directly with the catalyser from the opening frames an empty bowl which contained the catalyser) and when Charlie said its just another tomb "Bang the Alien related creature is buried here".

joylitt

Member

126

Posted Jul-03-2017 1:43 PM

What if the rock is an alien version of amber, and what is inside is a fossilized creature. Something that has religious significance for the Engineers.

IndyFront

Member

2

Posted Jul-03-2017 2:15 PM

@joylitt That would be badass lol

 

BigDave

Moderator

267

Posted Jul-03-2017 5:08 PM

" I have studied many artefacts, artistry of Judo/ Christian/ Hindu and even Moslem tradition and the idea a spreadeagled creature is embracing rather than crucificalo is outside of my experience."

I think its a interesting point and also the Christ Statue in Brazil and so indeed we cant rule out the Sacrificial Pose as being something else... Thus the only other reasons are this Creation had offered the Engineers something that was important,  maybe its a way they could Create Life by giving Birth and thus incubating Life within them... if this was something they had lost or was never able to do (Procreate by Giving Birth) Then the Mural would indeed be valued by them... i think this is what the Mural stands for.. but they Sacrificed this Creation because it was Perfect in their eyes and so to use its DNA to use to pass on to all Life they would now create.

Another option is if this Mural Deacon offered the Engineers some kind of Freedom?  The Christ Cruciform pose not only was about his Sacrifice, but its to inform us that through Christ Mankind can be Saved... his very being allowed for Redemption and Savior, and thus without his Birth Mankind would have none.

So the Deacon in some way could also be some kind of Savior of the Engineers, or those on LV-223.   Maybe it provided them a Freedom from Bondage?

"I don't think Ridley mis-spoke at all. When he said "this thing designed to make human beings", the "thing" he was referring to was the creation goop we see in Prometheus prologue. He was just saying if you think the Engineers made that stuff, you are wrong. That's what I heard, anyway."

I dont think there is enough evidence to suggest any theory is wrong, i may be wrong or i may be close, only RS and Lindeloff should know what the deal was and those who worked close to them... but even so we dont know how much things get Evolved as they go along, i would almost Guarantee after they started to Shoot Prometheus that doing a Sequel where David is revealed as the Xenomorph Creator, and a movie that skips Shaw completely... is NOT the Intention back then... so things can progress and change.

I think my theory is accurate but its not set as FACT, its just a conclusion i made, i feel at the Time it was fitting, but as things Evolve this theory can seem less and less likely.

I will say that "the "thing" he was referring to was the creation goop we see in Prometheus prologue"

Is a interesting take on what RS had said, i would be pretty open to considering this kind of theory also, we really do-not know how far or deep RS is going with the Origins of Life in General. And so for sure it could be the Goo is they KEY to All Life, maybe the Engineers were created from it, and they had then used the Tool of their creation to create Mankind.

The Beauty of the Plot in Prometheus is it leaves it open as far as who created MANKIND it could have been explored in a number of ways, just as how it could fit with so many Ancient Cultures and Religions...  The Sacrificial Scene showed a Engineer who looked very related to the LV-223 Engineers, it showed the Elders who look related too (but this was removed) So there are connections... 

The Sacrificial Scene could just have been how those beings on Paradise came to be,  in which case early Mankind could have been a Failed Experiment, where our Ancestors were kicked out of Paradise or Deemed to be Destroyed/Re-booted but somehow a few of us were taken away to Earth maybe by a Rogue Faction of Engineers who then had tried to subjugate us, maybe these Engineers even created us via Sacrificing one of those Humanoids, in a attempt to subjugate their own followers and thus play GOD.

Its so open.... the only way i can say the Engineers did not create us, is by looking at the Sacrificial Scene and then if they answer who is the Race who had Roped in that Sacrificial Engineer to do what he did.   The Engineer thus may not have created us, just that his DNA was used to lead to us.  Thus its in a way who ever created the Sacrificial Goo who truly created us, as this TOOL is what was needed, the Engineer merely the Genetic Genepool from which is required to create us.

If this Engineer acted in accordance with the Elders and the Elders are the same Race then in a way the Engineers still created Mankind, because those Ordering the Sacrifices are Genetically Related.  

Another aspect is the Sacrificial Scene again was not on Earth or how mankind was created, but it must mean that Mankind was created or Originated from the beings who were created via that Sacrificial Scene.

RS had said that the Sacrificial Scene was how these beings Seed Worlds and Create Life, not just on Earth.. that Scene could have been anywhere... but he did Ultimately say the Engineers had been back over thousands and thousands of years to Re-Engineer us over and over to thus Evolve us Genetically and Technologically.

The Ultimate Creator (Origin of Man) thus can be attributed to the Source of the Sacrificial Goo, we dont know how far or deep they will delve into this Substance, what its True Purpose is and how it was obtained... it could at the very least had been STOLEN/MISS-USED by the Engineers and not something they had ever created.

I could mention some of the stuff the Source said about P2 as this seems to offer a lot of clues. But again i cant even say if there is a single element of truth in it... unless Paglen/Green Draft comes to light

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

Moderator

267

Posted Jul-03-2017 5:18 PM

I will add the Alien Creature Remains Theory is also something to consider... i thought Holloway was referring to whats behind the Mural as another Tomb.  As it surely looked like a Door that could lead somewhere..  My Prometheus Re-write i actually took a look behind this and it had a Room with Sacrificial Murals and was more like the Star Beast Mural Room..... but also had Sacrificial Pods around where Sacrifices could be Held.

I interpret the object the Green Crystal is on as a Altar and i thought as the Engineers Culture revolved around Sacrifice, that it was maybe some kind of Sacrificial Altar?

The alternative one with the Cup/Bowl is clearer to see that it is positioned centrally and under it there was Canals running off it, groves in the Altar.  You could almost imagine if a Sacrificial Host is positioned inside this Altar and the Sacrificial Goo poured down and leaks into the Groves/Canals and then inside the Altar and onto what ever is inside.

I think its interesting to read all the theories and there is NO Single One that can be taken as 100% because RS/Lindeloff have never 100% confirmed in detail what this Mural and Altar and Crystal Purpose is... they left it open for interpretation.  I personal still lead towards what i came to, mainly because also Spaights Draft seems to give clues to this, especially the way the Scarabs work and the Sacrificial Cruciform Pose the Engineer had taken during his Sacrifice.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

BigDave

Moderator

267

Posted Jul-03-2017 5:33 PM

@Nathan Adler

Thats a good Question, we was intended to be Wiped out, but then the Outbreak prevented this... so we have to wonder why latter visitations had came along after 2000 years ago.

Was there a Faction who Sabotaged the Intended Mission to Destroy us?  But then why did they leave us similar Star Maps, was it a Warning... were beings who visited us trying to Warn us as far back as 35'000 years ago?  But then we have to then ask so was LV-223 Producing those Bio-Weapons for over 35'000 years?

Its very open to debate... it could be more likely the Engineers saying this is where YOU came from, without ever being a invitation... after we upset the Engineers and proved to be a Failed Experiment/Creation they then intended to Destroy us.

So then a Faction who did not agree with this, then made similar Maps as a Warning? But then where did they go?

My Personal Favorite Theory is the Space Jesus one... YES.. but not in Literal Sense... but how RS had said the Engineers sent down a Emissary to try and put us on the right track but we Killed him.

Now what if there were Many Such Emissaries on Earth, Once we had started to Kill them, the Engineers Abandoned us and then went onto to create the Bio-Weapons... but some Emisaries had remained in other Cultures that had not contact with other Continents.  For Example Hawaii and Mayan Ones.

These Cultures were maybe keeping more in tone to what the Engineers had intended for us as far as how we behave, and Worship the Gods, and Sacrifice to them etc.  So i will assume that Emissaries on those continents had educated those civilizations after the other Engineers had abandoned Earth.

Thats about best Logical Way i can explain it, other than that it could just be how by Word of Mouth these Maps get passed on over and over through culture and culture, just like in the Theory that all Religions and Mythos of Gods all came from a Actual Event/Gods and they are just told in slightly different ways through Civilization to Civilization.

Which Basically is what Prometheus was trying to show us.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Nathan Adler

Member

19

Posted Jul-03-2017 10:26 PM

@BigDave: If we interpret LV-223 as Leviticus, then this suggests the 'gazpacho' in the ampule room, etc. was a gift given to the Engineers.  The gifts given to God in this chapter were brought to him by the Israelites.  So was this suggesting a tribe of had brought God the black goo? In addition, it further advises that the 'priests' must show respect for these 'gifts' and if they don't, they are showing that they don't respect God's name; and that whoever makes physical contact with the 'gifts' will not only become 'unclean' but be separated/ cut off from God.  So does this finally resolve that LV-223 was originally a sacred place where the 'gift' of the black goo was brought to be revered, and the Engineers were 'priests' who disrespected it and were deemed 'unclean' and therefore 'cut off' from God?  And so they set about attempting to destroy God's other creations?  So were the cave paintings not invitations to us but records/ warnings from 'unfallen' Engineers warning us of the fate of the 'elegant, dark angels' for tampering with the black goo 'gift' and where not to go?  Was it actually a xenomorphed organism that killed the Engineers in the recording on LV-223, or was it discovered by their brethren who were those depicted in the Starmaps on Earth that had been tampering with the 'gift' to wipe out creation and they were subsequently punished for this iniquity?

Or were we the ones who 'gifted' the black goo to God, then at some point sought physical contact with it and were subsequently deemed as 'unclean' and deserving of being separated/ wiped out?  Dr. Shaw's notes of the pictograph from Val Camonica in Italy from the early Bronze Age, approximately 3,000 B.C. showed that humans there had seen a Space Jockey's seated not only in the cockpit, but initiating the navigation hologram for launch off.  So might this suggest they had previously taken a group of humans to LV-223 at some point and this is how those who drew the pictograph knew what the interior of a Juggernaut looked like?  Had they chosen an elect group of humans in 3,000 B.C. to LV-223, and we had stolen some goo from the temple/ ampule room (ala stealing the forbidden fruit)?

Michelle Johnston

Member

0

Posted Jul-04-2017 12:54 AM

@Nathan Adler

Your passionate questioning reminds me of ALL of the questions that have been speculated on since 2012. The tragedy of Covenant, and its dealt with politely by Damon in a recent interview , is based on his conversations with Ridley as to where they would go after Prometheus in Covenant they have not reached the "place of answers".

Can you imagine my frustration when I sat through a routine Alien movie which wasted 2/3 rds of the movie reintroducing a step on from the Deacon and in the other 1/3rd we received unsatisfactory answers to the David/Shaw story line. 

Prometheus's failings are quite simple :-

1) They did not make the link between the Engineers and mankind clear enough. Evidence that mankind had been taken to LV223 and experimented on would have made the Charlie/Shaw discoveries whilst David pursues Weylands Agenda more terrifying and invested the wake up with even more terror. 

2) The precise relationship between the catalyser and the Alien pathogen would have made clear something discussed between Pietro and Ridley LV 223 represented the fallen angels of Paradise Lost. 

If together with a much more taught Fifield arc (Oubliette/hugged/creature in the tunnel that we glimpse before being destroyed by security) which ramps up the terror for the Engineer awakening.  

If those matters had been handled correctly Prom would have been bullet proof as a creation myth movie and Prom 2 would have been able to bat A 5 off and move forward to the really fertile ground of David/Elizabeth and the Engineers mythos.  

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About Alien: Covenant

Alien: Covenant Movie

Release Date:

May 19th, 2017

Plot Synopsis:

Ridley Scott returns to the universe he created in ALIEN with ALIEN: COVENANT, the second chapter in a prequel trilogy that began with PROMETHEUS -- and connects directly to Scott’s 1979 seminal work of science fiction. Bound for a remote planet on the far side of the galaxy, the crew of the colony ship Covenant discovers what they think is an uncharted paradise, but is actually a dark, dangerous world -- whose sole inhabitant is the "synthetic" David (Michael Fassbender), survivor of the doomed Prometheus expedition.

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