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Xenomorph, Space Jockey, identical body types, which came first?

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Karstenphd

Jan-15-2017 8:27 PM

Friends, has anyone tried to piece together the body of the alien and its close resemblance to the engineer's  flight suit anatomy. Is it a suit or have the engineers done modifications on their own anatomies? I find this fascinating and in line with advanced concepts and behavior of beings that we are related to but have no idea of in the technological arena. It seems as if the pilot engineers might have sacrificed their bodies for gills and bodies adapted for space travel, even though this doesn't explain the "suits" hanging in the corridors.The suit seems to be a part of the engineer's anatomy, wich I kind of find cool, biomechanical, H.R. Gigerish. When I first saw   Alien it made perfect sense to me that it took on the characteristics of its host in the Derelict ship, of wich I thought the space jockey or pilot was an utterly alien being, not sharing our DNA. Now with Prometheus we have the humanoid Engineers, any thoughts or is it just me seeing similar features? Which came first the Engineer's flight suit, or the Alien body type? Are the suit removable, and if so why would they sleep in the sarcophaguses with them, the pilots seem almost dependent upon them.  

22 Responses to Xenomorph, Space Jockey, identical body types, which came first?

dk

Jan-15-2017 8:53 PM

Interesting comparison. It does appear the suits are part of the engineer's body. The Deacon sure had no problem busting through it. Maybe it isn't as strong as the Xeno body.

ninXeno426

Jan-15-2017 9:26 PM

It is an interesting ideas.Prometheus did kind of throw out the idea of the Space jockey being fused to the chair in favor of something new(i should note that the engineer was still locked into the chair).Thanks to the fact Giger designed the Space jockey and the xenomorph there is a resemblance but I'm not certain there related.Some have theorized that the engineers worship the xenomorph so this can be a way of showing it.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

dk

Jan-15-2017 9:34 PM

It does look like the Engineer is biomechanical. Note the neck area how everything blends and the overall head looks somewhat artificial.

ninXeno426

Jan-15-2017 9:35 PM

Think this one isn't the same kind from the beginning of the film?

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

dk

Jan-15-2017 9:39 PM

This was the one that birthed the Deacon. Yes, the ones in the beginning appeared humanoid. I have no idea of any relations. Just adding to what Karstenphd posted.

ninXeno426

Jan-15-2017 9:52 PM

I always assumed they were the same like he was pointing out with the space suits,but it does look like your right.One thing I've noticed about Prometheus is the engineer technology changed quite a bit from the opening to the ones later in the film(ex. the ship is different,and the robes were replaced by the suits)but it's possible they changed themselves over the course of millions of years.That or these ones aren't quite the same which is what i think we're getting at.Either way i hadn't given it much thought,thanks for pointing it out.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

Karstenphd

Jan-15-2017 10:48 PM

I always thought that the original alien was the prodigy of the space jockeys dna because of the similar body structure, and the xenomorph taking on the characteristics of it's host. I thought it was a no brainer. But I hope that the Engineer's body type, suit, or modified body functions, and relation to the original xeno is discussed in the Alan D. Foster novelization coming out or upcoming films. 

Karstenphd

Jan-15-2017 11:52 PM

Since I watched Prometheus looking for answers to the space jockey and xeno and was given more questions with black goo, outbreaks, humanoid engineers, vagisnakes and now we have covenant and neomorphs, spores, throat and backbursters etc. I wonder if we will ever get into if the sacrificial Engineer and elders and the one's piloting the spacecraft with the urns are primarily the same beings or physiologically different. I always tried to fill in the blanks with alien and now Prometheus, since a lot is left to the imagination. I wondered if the Engineer's are unable to reproduce because of tampering with their own dna in order to breed bodies built for flight, I don't know why this occurs to me it's just so much is left open for speculation. The bodies do appear to be modified and not suits, and I never really thought of the Engineer's as having reverence towards the xenomorph, interesting. 

Wrenchpede

Jan-16-2017 6:14 AM

Maybe the Engineers in the ship originally looked all organic like the ones from the begining but the black goo outbreak changed them. Or maybe it signifies that they have lost their ways with time, going from the spiritual monks from the begining of the movie to the militarised soldiers from the rest of the movie. Or maybe there are actually two factions.

Now I wonder if the Space Jockey from 'Alien' may actually be organic and not a suit. Maybe this "mutation" is supposed to make them more like the suits they wear for space travel. Hell the reason it was so big may lay in here.

Karstenphd

Jan-16-2017 6:46 AM

I hope that the space jockey and derelict are different beings/vessels than the humanoid engineers , athough it doesn't seem to be going in that direction. The Engineer's are key to the lead up to the original Alien film now, I hope they are done justice, because there was something utterly cool and alien with the original Giger space jockey.

ninXeno426

Jan-16-2017 12:22 PM

There's been a discussion that there might be two factions at war.

Nothing the God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in heaven for 

Hicks/Hudson

Jan-16-2017 12:36 PM

I hope, for the sake of this franchise, there isn't 2 factions of Engineers. This would create more questions and would create a stir to make another spin off movie about them/it if it's not addressed in Covenant or the possible sequal.

Alien: Engineer Wars. Your welcome Fox, I just titled it for you.

Xenowarrior1

Jan-16-2017 12:50 PM

i hope/ think the space jockeys and engineers are a different species...i wrote on a discussion before that maybe the engineers are the creation of the biomechanical space jockeys and they eventually over time began to resent the space jockeys( their creators ,as david has his) . They do this because the SJs refuse the engineers the knowledge and right to use their superior technology(black goo, ships etc) to experiment on after they accidentally create the pre-xenomorph..they then revolt agianst them and plant the egg into the pilot chamber before the SJ goes on his mission whilst stealing his technology and experiments,building ships and suits that resemble the original forms....making them the higher beings in their eyes...(the engineers began worshipping the xenomorph being before this but the SJ knew what they had created was pure evil and ordered they must never play god again and loaded the derilict with the eggs to put on an abandoned unhabited planet to prevent them killing anymore as one had killed another SJ after first being created.  the engineers resent this order as they worship this creature as the ultimate being and plot to take out the SJ and take over as the higher beings.

Tiago_miami_la

Jan-16-2017 1:34 PM

I rather want them to be the same.

The suit is xenomorph technology related fused with their bodys

BigDave

Jan-16-2017 4:16 PM

The suits and Xenomorph look connected... i think its no coincidence.

The biggest connection however is the Derelict and Xenomorph, they definitely are connected.... well its how it looks, what ever Construction or Geneticall Material the Derelict is... the Xenomorph seems to be connected.

Which came first, or was they created both from something else.

Then we can look at the Derelict and Juggernaught and Engineers and Xenomorph and ask.... is the Derelict a Evolution did something evolve the Juggernaughts to make the Derelict.

Or was the Juggernaught and Engineers Bio-Tech.. Reverse Engineered?

They have to be all connected... and it would be interesting to find out eventually how they are connected.

R.I.P Sox  01/01/2006 - 11/10/2017

Karstenphd

Jan-16-2017 7:32 PM

Nice, I would like to think of the black goo being gigerish enough to transform urns to biological eggs after centuries of neglect and why not transform the juggernaut as well, excellent! to me, this is the totally foreign aspect of alien that I thrive on!

ali81

Jan-17-2017 9:00 AM

before we get the first scene inside the engineers flight room where the engineer is in cryo sleep, we clearly see empty flight suits before david opens the door. the suits may be designed to function in a way that emphasises the engineers anatomy such as increased strength, interface when in the pilots chair and may also have fluid in it as to act in a similar way to a wet suit to keep the engineer warm but I for one don't think it is part of theyr anatomy. I know it has been millennia between the sacrifice scene but its clear they a similar anatomy to our own. if that wasn't the case, then the deacon would look completely different

Rick

Jan-17-2017 9:32 AM

Ali,

Are you talking about the bio armor the engineer wears?  If so that is actually part of his anatomy.  I rewatched cut fight scene between Shaw and the Engineer.  Whe nhe comes into the lifeboat.  You can see his gun shot wound on the left part of his chest.  He's bleeding dark green from the hole.  You can see it's much clearer in the cut scene I can't find it at work right now.

Dark Nebula

Jan-17-2017 9:58 AM

Since Giger designed the Alien and the SJ,it looks like they are somehow related.While working on Alien,most of Giger's work consisted of bald humanoids with biomechanical skins and a large murial with those humanoids wearing the suits with the simmilar design of the xenomorphs (chest,arms,biceps etc).

But which came first,engineers or the xeno idk.I suppose the original idea that the xenos and SJ's were both connected.

Its nice to see they keep using Giger's old designs.

Looks like they used some of Giger's old Alien concepts to update the engineer design.

While Prometheus was still in development,the engineer architecture was more monolith than biomechanical in look,then they took everything the designed and infused it with biomechanical look to stay truthful to Giger.Somebody discovered some Russian 3D artist that was doing mechanical landscapes,I think his name is Gutalin.Ridley liked his artworks so they hired him from long distance and I think that he did the design of the Juggernaut.

 

"Human heaven? Goodness, humans don't go to heaven.

Someone just made that up to prevent you from all going nuts."

- Kryten, Red Dwarf S3E06 "The Last Day"

ali81

Jan-17-2017 10:37 AM

if it is part of theyr anatomy then r they dead engineers standing outside the door that david enters? the last engineer clearly does not put anything on when he climbs up onto the pilots chair which suggests they wear them at all times during flight and in cryo but there is clearly, to me anyway, an empty flight suit next to the door when david first opens it. I wouldn't mind if im wrong and would def go along with the design similarities between the xeno and the engineer

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