Future of the series - Prometheus' Sequel(s) - Ideas, Expectations & Desires0 Upvotes155 RepliesUpvoteAdd A Reply
Alright, ladies and gentlemen. This has been a long time coming, and i believe it is finally about time that this thread came into existence. It has come to my attention that threads; no matter what the topic, have their topics go in a different direction completely. This topic of discussion that forms in threads is very specific. Very diverse. But is nontheless one. The reactions to Prometheus have been skewed. Whether or not you like, or dislike the film. Whether or not you were disappointed, or your feelings were the polar opposite; completely satisfied. People can't seem to help themselves, and start discussing improvements, what could have been. What should have been. And what could have generally improved Prometheus, and made it a superior film. I too was extremely disatisfied with Prometheus. But i'm still a fan! A fan of this world. This series. And i know that this is just the beginning. So, in that respect, i will be starting this thread for Prometheus, as a whole, as a series. It's a bit difficult naming the series; but that name will emerge in time. So no matter. I'm sure you all understand what this thread applies to. Every subsequent sequel that is in correlation with Prometheus. A thread where people can share their ideas. Expectations. Desires, and hopes. I strongly believe that we, as the fans. As the community that is passionate about this series, deserve to be heard by the producers, by even Ridley Scott himself. And everyone involved in production and development of the series. I have seen countless threads travel down this different path. And change their topics to this aforementioned, creative discussion. And i have heard nothing but great things. Excellent ideas from the community. From the members. Here's to all of you, and you're imagination! Here, we can compile this wonderful creativity. Let the discussion begin!
Picking up from the last five seconds of the film........ David suggests it is not a good idea to directly confront the engineers lest Shaw inadvertently motivates another mission to strike earth. David's ability to speak their language provides sufficient cover during intermittent contact with other ships but they must find the lowest risk method for Shaw's curiosity. From there the following revelations unfold: We created the engineers and we did not originate on earth. We were so obsessed with technological advancements and seeking control through knowledge we missed the value of life and progressed towards the erosion of our souls. We were becoming David. With no time machine available, we needed to find a way of starting over and an agreed proposal was creating older versions of ourselves in isolated locations. The universe is much larger than even the highest estimates affording countless earth like re-education camps with no concern of cross contamination. This model was repeated on earth which is why the ancient civilizations were isolated from each other yet shared the universal star map. After several failed attempts earth was abandoned and the equipment used to build massive structures like the pyramids was removed when the engineers left. Not everyone agreed and this eventually lead to the smuggling of technology which is why after thousands of years we suddenly have a technological explosion with no sign of slowing down. We are repeating the same mistakes our ancestors made. When it was discovered we had the ability for space travel we sent the engineers to quarantine earth. Permanently. We had become hollow as symbolized by the aliens busting out of people's bodies. The aliens entering the mouth reflects the choices our ancestors made on what they consumed and in turn consumed them. When Shaw makes her appearance with David our ancestors are thrown in an uproar at the irony we created exactly what they were trying to escape: existence without a soul.
Its hard to play with ideas, as the basics provided by prometheus are so "sick" (imo..). So this "deacon" should be the "first alien" or some kind of "pre-alien"? Nope, Sir! The engineers have been killed in the cave by aliens, remember? The slime on the wall david found (with no more information about the slime in prometheus), the dead bodies of engineers with holes in their chest / heads. Plus - the alien ship on LV-426 (Alien1). Much older then Prometheus story. So this can not be the first alien or pre-alien species shown in prometheus. But what was it then? I think - it was nothing. Just had to show some kind of alien because the studios wanted so. Completely dumb and unnecessary - yet. -------------------------------------------------------------- Anyway, how could the rap go on? What would i LIKE to see in a sequel? Real science fiction. Disturbing, weird, revolutionary story that makes sense and does not take you back every minute because its so unlogical and dumb. Stupid enough that Shaw wants to find the planet of the makers. What does she expect? They are superior and want to wipe out mankind. So does she expect they will invite her for tea and cakes? -------------------------------------------------------------- Lets say - her and david will find the planet of the engineers. I expect there a superior, really strange / weird species. Not the engineers. They are just "clones", worriors, humanoids. Made for a purpose, just like us. I would love the idea that engineers were made from US, not we from them. Hijacked people from earth, used for genetical experiments, to create a super soldier - just like the "engineers", who indeed are not "engineers of life", but slaves / soldiers / executives of the "real" engineers of life. -------------------------------------------------------------- I would like to see a yet unknown superior species. Intelligent. But not human. They should think with different "logic" then humans. We must not understand what they do and why they do that. We are limited, we are humans. So we will not be able to understand what is their goal. Maybe they dont have a goal, only humans have goals? I dont want some action/shooting spectacle good versus evil. I want SCIENCE FICTION. Like some philosophical outcome, a message. "We made you as a seed for our new generation of slaves. There is no deeper purpose. Now that we have what we wanted, the project is finished. We dont need human race anymore. Thats why we will start another experiment with planet earth. Black goo will change the surface of your planet. We speed up evolution. Strongest will survive. Thats the game. And we are only interested in the strongest, not in humanity and love. That is human. Not interesting. Thats only illusion, phantasy. It does not have anything with reality. Its all in your sick head, human!. And your individual life is senseless. We are interested in populations, not in individuals. Mankind is not the center of the universe. Your species is just one of many. And many many species are past. Like dinosaurs, and 99,9% of all lifeforms mankind will be gone. Something stronger will come. But thats not a problem - when mankind is completely distroyed, who will cry, when there is nobody to be afraid? Thats the game we play since beginning of time. Nobody made us. We allways existed - and in the same time never existed. There is no time and space. Its just in your limited imagination. You can only see and understand what we want you to see and understand. Thats the way we made you. Only humans think that ever lifeform needs a maker. Humans are so limited in their imagination. Thats how they are made by us. Their purpose is not to understand space and time. Just to be basic seed for our new creatures. Human spirituality, religion and philosophy is just a joke, an illusion. But this illusions are necessary to hide truth from you. The truth that you are our slaves, our toys."
this movie could have been much more, i mean why do humans have to be the center of attention here, this utterly betrays the vastness of the the universe. there are many other things out there ridley could have used and he had to make everything link back to humans, now basically its like humans and jockeys are cousins or something. When we first saw the jockey in alien, it was simply something we could not comprehend, something so far from humanity. The mysteriousness behind it all, thats what this movie should have been about.
[img width=351 height=150]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ML_kFkjpdzE/SK6uPUT8iKI/AAAAAAAAGm4/tzk1lye2eZE/s400/vlcsnap-94269.jpg[/img] "Frostmourne Hungers"
@King: Hollywood knows that you need human characters in a movie, even if they are superficially so, like Hobbits. It's what makes money. Even with the limited dialogue that takes place in 2001, it wouldn't have been half the film that it was without human characters. I disagree with you fundamentally that there was too much focus on humanity in Prometheus. As well as posing interesting questions about our origins and future, most people find human interactions and problem-solving interesting. And it's hardly like the vastness of the universe was ignored – just look at the Map Room. It's a great launchpad to take the story into well uncharted territory.
I agree with zzplural. It was not human centric at all and the best proof is they estimated the decapitated alien body to be 2000 years old. It is pretty clear earth was a target but for some reason nobody made sure the task was completed and more importantly, never investigated why the dispatched team never returned. Two primary reasons: 1. They were not significant in any way so the lack of their return was meaningless. Likewise, the failed mission to strike earth was such a low priority, nobody followed up. Like a human swatting at a fly in the a park, we are too insignificant for a second effort. 2. The alien species was wiped out by an enemy. Jumping towards the end of the film, when the last of the Blue Man group woke up from his nap, he was right back on mission status without missing a beat. He seemed more like a robot than another biological entity. This sparked an ides that maybe the film could go in a sci-fi direction I've not yet seen: A superior species found a way to combine the essence of a soul with a robot or android. The revelation would be humans are actually droids and nothing on earth is actually biological. Every single item in existence is comprised of nanobots, taking us to the comment from David the big things have small beginnings.
Fantastic idea Pren, I'm gonna STICKY this topic so people come here first to discuss just this!
Whatever killed those Engineers in the caves leading to the ship was something either originating or coming after the black goo. Shaw, Holloway, even Weyland believed that they were going to find the essence of immortality . . . talk about a rude awakening when they arrive. "We wrong! We're were so wrong!"-Shaw What I want to see in Paradise is a deeper understanding of why the Engineers wanted to destroy us. What kind of situation are they currently in. Are we really their main target. Are they under attack from another species (and yes, I believe the introduction of Predators is a possibility, many of you don't). And exactly how the Xenomorphs (in particular, the Deacon) tie in to the Engineer culture. I highly doubt that the Engineers are going to be hospitable towards Shaw, David and however else is included in the cast. They going to have to confront either them, or the ultimate consequences of the black goo, probably both. Prometheus, thanks in part to Scott's genius, is probably one of the most deceiving plots in Hollywood history
Warrior 7 just triggered a third option as to why 2000 years had passed without the Engineers destroying earth. In addition to the two I mentioned above: 3. The Engineers were a rogue element of their species. Maybe the Engineers as a species was unaware of dissenters who embarked on the mission? Or maybe they were mercenaries hired by a different species seeking habitable planets requiring the indigenous life to be wiped out? Whatever the reason one aspect is pretty solid: striking earth was not a high priority.
Regardless specific directional development, I really hope two things are changed: No more completely out of whack characters like the geologist. Better job at disguising surprises. It was painfully obvious Weyland was not dead during his opening speech to the crew and that Vickers was his daughter. I expected more creativity from Scott but overall, I liked it a lot.
Ok so I am thinking part 2 : find out about the engineers and possibly elders a bit and a slight hint of the demi god and open the world up to just how big the universe is. And just what would happen with highly intelligent life after millions of years if not billions of year of evolution. Lots of mystery still but some information now flowing out but paradise turns out to be just the beginning of the hunt for the creators of earth life etc....I am hoping prophecies are involved and other religious actions but based more on science and more factual arguments. The black goo is worshipped as such...but no why.
Part 3 : we start to see many more races and levels of evolution maybe some even nice un-interested in humans prophecies carry on. The black goo comes from the demi-god the engineers have no idea what it is from exactly and think it will bring about the arrival of the universes creator. But they are blind to the fact its just a very old life form which is not nice and very powerful and intelligent. Luckily it looks at humans like ants so does initially go after us until we get its a attention!
part 4: wraps up and shows demi god in full showing what it actually is possibly it is at war with an entire race maybe the elders for instance who are way more advanced than the engineers. more opening up of the milkyway and hints of the universe and what is out there. Possibly something even more advanced destroys the demi god. Possibly this one is set after alien and the engineer in alien is wrapped up in the last film or it happens in this. This one blows my mind with its vastness and the sheer magnitude of it all :) .
Thats my what I want I haven't put the smaller details but it would take too long :S .
What I think will happen:
part 2 : better but similar to prometheus with its mistakes ... no helmets... idiots getting killed no apparent technology except android and spacecraft and a few bits...no futuristic tech. And not very realistic. Less people watch it but it still gets money.
Part 3 : with the down turn on the last film this one gets a kick up the back side but its still following the same routes ... poor tech ideas and realism. film get less followers and it looks like part 4 wont be made.
Part 4 : Low budget but gets finished bad film series in the end :(
But hopefully that never happens the ship gets corrected and it all works out! But I feel that's less likely right now...
"It's almost as if they are making it up as they go along" :D
Also, like I was telling Uneeque, the xenomorphs we see in Alien and Prometheus could possibly just two species of an entire Animal Kingdom based from the black goo. Fassbenger was said in an interview that what we see in Alien and Prometheus are just bits and pieces of a much more epic and horrifying scale. The climax to this series will no doubt put the Alien franchise to bed for good
Uneeque, it was not painfully obvious that Weyland was alive, stop your lying.
Going off Warrior's post and the end of the movie...... After Shaw leaves with David the Deacon enters the crashed ship and is attacked but not killed by the goo-squids. The Deacon escapes and seeks out another Engineer ship. While enroute in pursuit of Shaw, the Xenomorph is "born" causing the ship to crash on LV 426 due to nobody being the pilot. Some of the goo squids survived and attacked the first xenomorph. No other species exist on LV 426 so the xenomorph reaches its final product unchanged over the next 30 years. It does not change appearance after hosting with humans because it's DNA structure is superior, being descendants of Engineers, Deacons and the goo squids. The animal kingdom is created by the unpredictable results of interactions with other species but what they all share is a laser focus on death. This is a good philosophical argument against seeking weapons over non violent conflict resolutions. The hate that consumed the creators of the goo is the same hate that killed them, which is eerily close to what we have done with the creation of nuclear weapons.
SubsumeYou, Please allow me to re-phrase. It was painfully obvious to me Weyland was still alive and these are the three clues I made the conclusion from: 1. In his hologram speech he bragged about dedicating his life to seeking life's most difficult answers. Given his power and resources he seemed like the type of person who was seeking immortality and wanted to be on the same footing as the gods, hence his reference to resurrecting Prometheus. 2. When he stated David was the closest thing he would have to a son you can see Vickers turn her head down and away from the hologram in a mixture of contempt and jealousy. 3. The extremely rare and expensive automated surgical machine. Vickers was much too arrogant to think she would be dumb enough to put herself in a situation to need such a universal healthcare system. After those three points in the film to me it was obvious he was still alive and it was reinforced in two subsequent scenes: 1. After the majority of the team returns to Prometheus Vickers slams David against the wall and makes the demand: "What did he say!?!" Who on the ship would have been in a position to have an insulator between himself and Vickers? 2. When Shaw rushed to the Med lab machine she requested a C-section on the claim the machine was there for Vickers. Do you remember what the machine's response was? Operation could not be performed due to it being calibrated for a male. Vickers was not a male. Hope that helped clear up how I reached my conclusion while watching the film.
Do we know if the other ships David mentioned had Engineers in hypersleeep or hiding from the goo squids? If so, it dramatically changes any approach to the sequel.
@Chris Yes, thank you again for the support Chris. Greatly appreciated. But i'm not really treating this as something i can look back at, personally. I really wanted to do this for everyone. So we can better the series. And take it further. And so more poor forum members don't get their threads hijacked , AHAHA! But no, i really love the idea of this megathread. Compiling all our thoughts and ideas. To help improve the series. And discuss what was wrong with previous films. And of course, this only applies to Prometheus, as it's the only film in the series so far. Anyhow. Enough reiteration. Time to get down to business. @King Yep. One of the many things i feel should be explored. Of course there has to be emphasis on humanity. But more so on the Engineers! I want the movie to have more discovery. And an incredible amount of immersion. As seen in Avatar. Beautiful, alien environments. And one of the things i can't stress enough; Shaw and David should be taken in by the Engineers. As visitors. One word that can best describe humanity. Without a doubt; is curiosity. And that is something that the Engineers should tend to in Shaw. I'm not saying it should all be coffee and talking. But... going back to Avatar - I absolutely loved how the main character was totally immersed in this alien world. Experienced everything. Saw things from a different perspective. And spent time amongst this alien race, and saw things their way. I want that feeling again! Except of course, in Ridley Scott's own way. I want it to truly be epic! Nice, and long... And mind you, the Engineers aren't some blue folks that are reminiscent of the aboriginals of our own planet. In the real world. They're very much different. And to be honest... it goes deeper than that. Let's face it... if the Engineers wanted to send the world on a genetic override, while destroying humanity in the process. They would have done so. They are clearly in a much different situation than they were 2 millenia prior. And i would very much like to see the Engineer Homeworld just that; Paradise. Now, i'm not exactly saying rainbows as far as the eye can see. Queer-blue skies *clears throat*, and kiddy happiness. Just pure... alien beauty. Maybe even something the Engineers EXCLUSIVELY perceive to be paradise. While in our eyes. It is the most bizarre site in the UNIVERSE! Well.. alright. The galaxy, anyway. After all, these folks have a different mentality towards many things. Elders. Life, and death. And the ramifications it has, while being carried out by themselves. Their practice of self-sacrifice to create. @Warrior7 Hey, here's a link to something i posted up... but might just incorporate that into this thread, if possible. And if Chris deems it worthy. [url=http://www.prometheus-movie.com/community/forums/topic/8149]Engineer/Xenomorph Connection[/url]
I have posted some ideas way back...and it is hard to keep track of all postings, but I would like to see a sequel where we find the Real Space Jockeys. Maybe we find out these engineers we saw so far are a rogue faction or a faction at war with the Space Jockeys, and are copying their tech, possibly bacause they are related on a deeper level: THe negineers were designed and creted by the real Space Jockeys as their bio-tools. We can also see in a sequel something related to their biotech oriented civilization. Maybe the reaction against David was caused by their aversion to conventional tech, even bordering a religious side of their culture, and that might cause even more problemas if David reveals himself when Shaw arrives at their Home Space. We know there is a conflict (or there was) requiring the use of those bio-weapons as well, and that is important to the concept so we might see something about this in the sequel, if they really depict Shaw going to their homeworld...though the sequel might even let Shaw and her epic journey to the third installment, focusing the next movie on something else, maybe the events that led the derelict to crash land on LV426. Shaw's trip is per si an epic element, a sole human going to face beings so much advanced that they are deemed godlike, and they might not even e benevolent as some of them tried to wipe Earth clean. But we do not knw yet if their whle cvilization is after such of just that installation on that barren moon. That is not clear, and maybe the recording of those engineers running depict an atack done by official forces against their rogue installation. They have not returned so our destruction was never really a top priority, what aslso might mean they as a whole were not with that intention. The clues to what will come are little, and the movie now is a very pliable story, that can move to a grea many directions, that is for sure.
@Uneeque: If, instead of old Weyland being dragged out of hypersleep, a young clone emerged instead, would that have been 'painfully obvious' too?
Weyland being on the ship was not exactly obvious up to that scene. After it, we could have surmised his presence, but only after that scene, which took place almost at the end of the movie anyway. I liked it, and it was an iteresting surprise. I expect to see more on Weyland, as surelly there will be mre scenes with him depicting years prior to that voyage, otherwise why use Guy Pearce in makeup?
I explained why I thought it was obvious and explained it with pretty good detail. It appears some who did not see the same clues are upset for not seeing them which would explain the useless animosity. If anyone wants to address it again then please cite why the reasons I gave were unreasonable instead of simply ignoring them. Now....if we could be so brave to stay on topic. I noticed something from posting in a different thread and I'm sure countless others have as well but I've not seen it mentioned here and it may be important for the sequel. It is regarding awareness revelations: (Alien) Ash admitted the ship was not accidentally steered towards LV 426 in response to the homing beacon because he was given a specific directive to land on the planetoid. The beacon was nothing but a ploy to make it appear random to the crew. (Aliens) The flight data and shuttle were sanitized after Ripley was recovered by the salvage team thus making her story seem crazy. This suggests Weyland received Shaw's warning and sent an investigation team to survey not just the installation, but other planetoids as well. Is it possible the colonists were sent to LV426 as test subjects rather than to terraform? Since people knew of the species is it possible they have since made contact with the Engineers? The hundred year gap between Shaw's warning and Ripley returning to LV426 certainly affords enough time for people to successfully find species beyond LV223. What are the chances the sequel will have people aligned with an alien species against other people? In any event, there seems to be enough background to show Shaw may not be the only person to have gone past LV223 in search of the engineers and other DAVIDs could use the ships on LV223 to basically follow Shaw by a half step.
Well, it seems The Company (I liked more when it was only a huge dark shadow over them...) could use others, and David on Prometheus was very capable of undestanding engineer language, but as we saw Weyland himself, the founder of The Company, I thin he would keep it all wrapped to a few ones, and he could even have done the fatal mistake of not even sharing the material he had over fearing others to look fot what he wanted and arrive there before him. It is a fair concept to imagine though that The Company director's board after Weyland departure take more profit oriented decisions and start looking for the wepons...but it wuld be hard to really connect these ideas because instead of making the Nostromo go to LV426 (a moon from the Zeta II Reticuli sytem) it would have been easier to go back to LV226. For this to connect to ALIEN Shaw's message would have been lost. One thng I also notice, if we keep all this really conected to ALIEN, we already know that whatever Shaw will do has little to no effect to Earth, as Prometheus takes place decades before The Company sends the Nostromo to LV426 and well, basically, Earth is still there... A somewhat disapointing thing, no real reacton to whatever Shaw did...and might mean that we are of no concern or their civilization is really gone...
Nostromo was there thirty years after Shaw lifted the engineer's ship so I'm sure they had enough resources and time to survey several planets. I don't see how Shaw's message would have been lost for this to connect to Alien. The story is incomplete so we do not yet know what chain of events Shaw participated in to measure any effect from her actions. It is quite possible her actions helped set up protection for earth or simply delayed an attack on earth. No way to tell just yet. Knowing the ability of the sleep chambers on the Engineer's ship it is also possible Shaw pulled a Ripley on crack and slept for five hundred years, bringing her into Paradise with no time limit between DAVID's decapitation and the beginning of the sequel. Maybe the timeline has already been released in the teasers for Paradise?
Well, we know the FTL they use takes years to traverse given distances, and the engineer ship also used hypersleep chambers, so that is a route they can use for sure, which could explain why nothing happened during that time. Still illogical to bypass LV226 for bioweapons and go after a derelict ship on LV426, but then Weyland Ind. Bio-Weapons Div. might have done that under the cover of their own fellow sections... AS for what comes, if we see the sequel bypassing the previous movies, it would be even more interesting to see what they will really do with the series altogether. There is a lot to pull rogether until then. About Shaw message, was it sent to Earth or is it being transmitted by the lifeboat? If it is in the lifeboat it might be that it was turned off by malfunction or something similar...that could cover for ALIEN and the way The Company acted with the Nostromo crew...
Why couldn't they have done LV226 and had Nostromo visit LV426 too? Since Weyland is a private company it seems Shaw's message was sent to them and not the general public. Since Weyland financed and organized the expedition, I'm sure the company was excited to know it paid off because Shaw's message proved they found another species. Since the spacecraft on LV426 was an alien ship, does that mean it was from a different source than the Engineers? Possible but I don't think so.
I've been overlooking a scenario for the ship on LV426. What if it is the ship Shaw and David borrowed from LV223? (Isnt it 223 and not 226?)David's programmed loyalty was to Weyland, not Shaw. He lied to her to get off LV223 and report back to Weyland on Earth. They crashed on lv426 due to being attacked by the Bio weapons on board. There is no reason to think they would have been found by Nostromo because their remains would have easily been lost by either the crash or xenomorphs. Maybe Weyland used one of the ships on LV223 to locate the ship Shaw left on? Their technology certainly seemed capable of long distance low jack.
Pre~ have you been on the WHAT BECAME OF 10 11 12 (marketing site) recently and clicked on all the unlockables? There's a PICTURE OF DEACON attacking two humans - seriously. That's where Pro~2 is going? Another Texas Chainsaw Massacre villain? the [url=http://www.projectprometheus.com/discover/]QUESTIONS WILL BE ANSWERED[/url] orb.
Humm This is bad news for the future of the series, if that is correct. THen again it would be logical that Weyland Ind. would send a team back to that moon as the lifeboat was there. Probably, and ok with that, the next movie would show a rescue team arriving at that moon and being attacked by that thing. No problem with that as long as they do not lead the sequels into the Monster Movie gente again. On the ships being compared here, despite their exterior being similar (same production line/principles as both are milllitary by what we know) they are not identical, especially the bridge. THe ship we saw in Prometheus has many features not seeing in ALIEN's derelict ship, not including size, which is totally different. Now, Shaw got another ship so that is still open, maybe the ship she got is different....but I doubt it. The whole scene from ALIEN reeks of old age, and the Space Jockey there is huge and seems dead for a very long time...and by the accounts we have from the producers, it has been dead for a long time indeed. I do not see Shaw crashing her comandered ship right after taking off...I think she will for to Paradise...what remains to be seen is which way the movie will take from then on...that intrigues me greatly
Here is an image from A1979 space jockey: http://deadlymovies.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/space-jockey-seat.jpeg This is from Prometheus http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-xkGHNXllBWU/TyHlySePrVI/AAAAAAAAbX0/dUN1kOztA8o/s1600/whoisthat-1.jpg They look pretty close to me. Edit Just read a Scott interview and they are the same. Edit 2 What was the source of the sample David slipped in Charlie's drink? Did it come directly from the Bio weapon or was it a sample taken from the result of the Bio weapon raping and killing the Engineers?
@Freeplanet - When you click the 'Paradise' orb, the site locks down, too?
@Freeplanet. Could you post up the pic of the Deacon attacking two people, please? I have no patience for that piece of GARBAGE flash site. And it crashes... If it isn't possible. Which orb is it under? Also. Again, i really hope the Engineers just don't end up being antagonists... We have the Deacon, and its kind for that purpose :D.
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